Musk's interference to protect Russia allowed Russian attacks on Ukrainian cities, and resulted in the deaths of civilians including children - Zelensky advisor.
One of many articles: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/musk-stopped-ukraine-attack-russian-fleet-starlink-rcna104019
The US has spent at least 80 Billion dollars arming and supporting Ukraine in it's defense against Russian genocidal aggression and Western expansion that puts the entire NATO block in jepordy, why is Elon fucking Musk allowed to put his thumb on the scale in favor of the enemy? Why isn't anyone in the Biden administration tearing him a new asshole form stem to stern, why isn't anyone in the Biden administration publicly discussing nationalizing Starlink. We're literally throwing money into conflict (for absolutely necessary, vital, and justified reason) that one man is deciding the outcomes of, and the United States government is just ..... what .... ok with this?
I'm just some dumbfuck but,..money?
Pretty much - Muskrat most likely privately funds (read: bribes) enough government officials to either stand by and do nothing or actively interfere.
This advisor should also consider the lack of response from the US itself as part of the problem - Muskrat is helping out an enemy, but uhhh… what the fuck did the government do to curb that shit from happening in the first place?
Money from the guy who moves his companies to dodge taxes?
One thing that seems to be the case with Biden's administration - there's a lot going on behinds the scenes that we're not aware of.
You're right, there should be some life changing repercussions for Musk. Hopefully we'll find out those are in the works.
It's insane to me that the CEO of a private company can directly engage to change the outcome of a battle without the whole population completely losing their shit over it. This asshole turned off his product to intentionally prevent our ally from succeeding in a battle against our enemy. And his reason is that he was trying to prevent escalation. How the fuck is that his call to make?
concentrating wealth and power on individuals is literally the point of private property 😅
Yes. Because a lot of powerful people stand to make a shitload of money off this conflict. The longer it goes, the more weapons it requires. The more weapons it requires, the more money they make.
Isn't most of that $80 billion in the form of weaponry ordered from US manufacturers? Or maybe I've misunderstood. I thought much of the cash hasn't really left America.
But yeah, musk needs to be stopped. No one person should have so much power, it makes a joke of democracy.
Most of it is actually old equipment they're taking out of storage. Of course the US likes to have stuff like that around for various contingencies, one of which is the exact thing it's being used for now. So new equipment will be bought for the US military and existing equipment will be placed into a storage a little sooner than usual.
But a big chunk of that price tag is ordinance, and yeah that needs to be re-ordered right away.
But at any rate, yeah nearly all of it is from US manufacturers, though there may be a few parts and things from allies like Canada.
I don't feel like nationalizing Starlink for the USA is best for everyone. It is a world-wide network, I feel like it would be better as something that isn't controlled by any single country (but, obviously I agree it should not be controlled by a single billionaire fuck-boy either...).
Spoiler: they dont want the war to end.
Why with all those billions are we relying on a private company for military communications? I'm not excusing Musk AT ALL, but communications are insanely important in a conflict. Why are these governments spending all of this money and not just doing it themselves? If the military ordered supplies from Walmart and Walmart didn't deliver them, wouldn't we be asking the government instead "why the hell did you do that?"
Another "liberal" who hates democracy...
Why isn't Biden just confiscating a private company??? Are you serious?
How are these things in any way related?
Democracy - the people voting on laws; representative democracy - the people voting for representatives to vote on laws
Nationalizing a company that provides a fundamental, necessary world wide service because one man decided he could determine the outcome of a battle.
Hmm... not really sure how these two things are related.
Billionaires are not democratic.
It's not so hard to understand why, have fun doing simple math...
No. The real question is why does one man, because of his wealth, have so much power over the life and death of other people he has no interest in.
Wealth and capitalism is anti-democratic. And this is a prime example.
Not directly and not necessarily.
Being a little rich isn't a problem. Being very to insanely to disturbingly rich, that is a big problem and should be removed as a possibility by governments. Tax the shit out of people until their riches reach acceptable levels
Capitalism is only anti democratic if left unchecked. It needs to be much MUCH more limited than it currently is. But you don't want to remove it, capitalism is -unfortunately- the most successful way of running societies. Again, you want to limit the crap out of it and right now it's just running in stampede mode which indeed will destroy democracies
The academic model of capitalism has safeguards in place to prevent the shitshow we're living in now. Leave it to us Americans to knock off those safeguards because we're greedy as hell.
Yes, so is individual freedom.
They all do, this action is just more obvious.
Because the government didn't want to pay for it... that would be "communism". (they're paying now, way to be coherent!)
Wait, are you saying Elon Musk's actions directly resulted in innocent women and children being murdered?
It would be terrible if more people started saying that Elon Musk murdered innocent women and children.
The murder is kinda still Putin's doing but he supported it.
These stories about how much of a piece of shit Musk is have been piling up for years now. I think people driving around in Teslas are going to get some damage done to their cars soon.
I'd rather not phrase it this way because it's true. The point of this structure is that it was always bullshit.
It's not straight up murder. I might have some (limited) sympathy for Elon in this case. But he should be able to see past the first action in that series of events. I believe he was dumb enough to not think of more than the surface (more on that later). If he's not that dumb, then he truly is evil. Those submarines are not defensive.
I think he's managed to surround himself with alt-right grifters* who have him truly believing most of the absolute bullshit they spout. This doesn't excuse him for what he's doing to the world on their behalf.
*These grifters don't necessarily go after money directly. They also grift to direct his influence and money to their causes.
The right isn't stupid. They use a stupid message to maintain control of the conversation as a diversion tactic that is very effective. The whole point of this is to ensure no legitimate reforms and legislation are put in place. We fall for it every time we get enraged by the bullshit. That is the joke, we are the joke, and there is no way around the fact we will spend the next 2 weeks pushing back before the next prescribed side show drops into the circus. The outcome is fixed and calculated well in advance. This entire thing is planned out. I doubt they expected this one to have quite this big of an impact, but it will disappear just like all the rest. If a supreme court justices can be openly corrupt, there is no question the oligarchic prince will walk away completely free. We have entire states like Georgia fighting against justice for the biggest coup attempt in this country's history. The perpetrator at the center is still free years later. King Musk is invincible because of Republican Russian Red team and their oligarchy.
Elon Musk is afraid of Putin's revenge. Crucial infrastructure like Starlink should be handled by the government, not a corp. Otherwise the corp will prioritize shareholders and profit rather than human's life
Putin 100 percent has kompromat on Musk. Likely the pedophile shit he did with Trump and Epstein.
I'm so tired of these literal cartoon villains having power I stg
I think he’s basically gullible. His companies have given him so much money, he just assumes he’s right. However he doesn’t understand diplomacy and Putin played him. He should have deferred to the state department, who deal with that BS all the time
A couple of years ago, Musk stated that Putin is substantially richer than he is.
Add to that Putin's bloodthirsty lunacy. Musk may actually fear his wrath.
But then comes the issue, which government? As Starlink is global infrastructure.
Pretty sure he's talking about the government of the country the company is registered in. As the is the only one that can realistically nationalise it.
Starlink is only 'global' as long as Elon approves of the GPS coordinates. With that in mind, 'global' is about a joke, it's at Elon's whim...
So, explain to me how Elon should not be considered a strategic target now? He is materially supporting the Ruzzians by killing innocent civilians. He cannot be ignored at this point.
It seems he should be considered an obvious target by anyone who wishes to support the Ukranian defense. Maybe someone close enough to him supports Ukraine and will see a moral obligation (and opportunity) to defend Ukraine.
Russia is a sanctioned nation with a public history of cyber attacks and false flag attacks on Americans. They also openly meddled in the 2016 and 2020 elections (thank fuck they didn't pull 2020 successfully).
Providing aid and comfort to Russian military and political figures is explicitly treason.
I think I recall the punishment for treason is pretty stiff. The day he is held accountable will be a day for celebration.
I'm amazed US DOD hasn't torn him a new asshole considering they're now paying to use Starlink in Ukraine. Musks ability to decide how Starlink should be used is a clear security risk.
They might have behind the scenes
If he’d have just been smart and quietly sucked the government teat, he’d be set with DoD contracts.
Agreed! At this point, the DoD would be ignorant to not prioritize their own development of an LEO network. Once in place, they could dislodge or remove any of Elon's floating shitballs to prioritize the safe operation of their own, citing national security. Fuck Elon.
Musk is everything but a communist
Ha. You can make the R and L smaller.
(And he's not a communist, exact opposite of it.)
Its interesting that he’s poking the marshmallow here, because Musk can still turn off Starlink, or make it unusable for Ukraine as much as his contract with DoD allows. This implies that Ukraine screamed bloody murder about this months ago, and DoD has given them gear to be able to bypass Starlink.
I think DoD also doesn’t like Elon having this kind of power, and allowed him to be a stopgap now that they never plan to use again. It’s interesting from a geopolitical and financial perspective for Starlink; they blew it and they’re not a future reliable partner for taking Russia’s side.
A lot of people are missing the big picture here. Look up Starshield. SpaceX is aggressively hiring for the Starlink DoD edition essentially. I suspect the US govt is not as worried about this as you think
I’d say at least that’s a black eye. Good observation about the Starshield stuff.
Using starlink is now directly supporting the Russian invasion
Absolute nonsense, Starlink is firmly on the side of the Americans.
Good luck making the average person make this connection. People are still buying and driving Teslas.
The US should nationalize Starlink. If private business decisions are going to undermine world stability then those decisions are antithetical to any kind of peace and need to be treated as the threat that they are. A single person picking sides shouldn't result in a casual body count that Elon never is punished for but it now does and he looks to be getting away with actual manslaughter.
The response we’ll see is the DoD making their own Starlink, but with $500 toilet seats and $100 hammers. Aw, forget the Starlink, we’ll just do those.
God damn that was so well said. All I could come up with was “Fuck Elon Musk”.
Yeah, "cocktail of ignorance and big ego" is a perfect description of Musk.
He's a saboteur. Detain the mother fucker and try him for treason. At the very least, his removal from his companies is paramount to national security at this point.
No, no, you don't understand...he's rich.
Why are we getting him high first?
So the Ukrainians don't have to lead him as far.
So we can drop Joe Rogan off with him at the same time.
So he's less capable of surviving?
Ukraine should make sure he doesn’t do that again
I've been trying to find the source but I'm certain Ukraine have developed their own.. Technologies now? That their drones rely on. If I dig it up ill edit this post.
Edit, found it was a video I'd heard it from. A combination of technology.
Reporting from Ukraine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNhc8beBdD0
Ukraine can stop using Starlink any moment they want... but for some reason they don't.
How many lives has Starlink saved so far?
Meaning?
Whether or not any of this bullshit is true, I'm just glad that there's growing distain for billionaires.
"But wait, there's more!"
Seems to be the to not only be a famous line from the late Billy Mayes, but also the correct response when someone is disgusted by what a shit person Musk is...
Didn't think "Child Murderer" was going to wind up on his sin list.
At least we have a public confession, try him.
Starlink is a great system. The problem is its idiot owner, Musk, who is more worried how the use of Starlink in the Ukraine is going to affect his company stock. You're in the big leagues now, Elmo. You cant "sort of" commit to a war unless you're a rich Saudi dilettante, who wants to try his hand at international shiat-stirring.
The use of Starlink was restricted by US Government sanctions: no use on Russian territory or assets.
Tough luck, that also means no using it for attacking on Russian territory or assets.
Edit: Here's a link with sources and dates.
Crimea is Ukraine. Also that's not how sanctions work at all
It's very impressive how someone can be so wrong yet so confident at the same time.
That's a remarkably interesting link, thanks for sharing.
Musk didn’t allow it. Full stop. It’s not so,e government sanction thing.
Even quotes you reference are from Musk, himself, sharing why he decided so. Musk said he chose not to activate it because he’d be apart of escalating the war…
Great example of people downvoting the truth away. The spectacle of American politics can no longer address material truths, outside of merely referencing good or bad actors.
Elon's negative image is proof because he used to be widely considered as someone solving the climate crisis through free market capitalism, but the truth is he never changed and has always been this way, and the system he operates in where people need cars is the problem.
It's also a given that Americans are blind or refuse to acknowledge the effects of their government's sanctions on the world, the private business interests that benefit, and the way they exploit people like themselves in other countries and use them as pawns.
Exactly why taiwan is looking to build their own system. You can't entrust anything to musk with his deep saudi-china links
Taiwan, meanwhile, is hesitant to use Starlink’s services for fear of Musk’s close ties with China. A dominant player in the global chips market, Taiwan feels exposed to the constant threat of Chinese invasion. Using Starlink might be one way to bolster its national and data security—especially when Taiwan suspects China of cutting its submarine internet cables. But for Taiwan to rely too heavily on Starlink might prove unwise, in the event that China pressures Musk to limit network access abruptly, as he has done in certain situations in Ukraine.
https://qz.com/china-taiwan-starlink-elon-musk-satellite-tensions-1850691740
And if they do they could let Ukraine use it, as they're likely more trustworthy than Musk.
Still, I dont see in that article where it says Taiwan is building its own system, is there another source?
Why the fuck are they relying on starlink.
They don't have a choice, everything else requires ground based infrastructure.
Starlink technically requires ground based infrastructure but they don't need to be in Ukraine. The closest Starlink ground stations to Ukraine are in Turkey and Poland, according to this map.
Because Russia blew up domestic infrastructure, so satellite based communication looked like a decent alternative.
the question is why the fuck was a private company allowed to build and operate star link?
Musk is creeping into super-villan territory.
He's already at James Bond villain levels.
Lol, his most memorable presentation is showing that the cybertruck is not as durable as he claimed.
Actually, now thinking about it... has that shit even finished? Or close to? A lot of people already paid for it.
That's treason,.... is it not?
For Ukraine yes this treason. But in USA if you an oligarch with a lot of money you can do what you want. I won't be suprise if the republicans will promote to stop the war by not sending ressources to Ukraine. You know, to promote democracy and free world...
I think there’s even a decent case to make this distinction, that Starlink is for communication but not attacking. The problem is making the decision unilaterally, in secret, with no warning, and contrary to customer expectations, with timing that uniquely benefits an enemy of civilization
Technically, no. But I doubt that Musk will be getting any contracts in Ukraine after the war. Probably ruined any other future business in any of the other countries in a similar situation as Ukraine bordering Russia as well.
Russia is an enemy aggressor nation. Helping their military and their government without U.S. Congress approval is treason.
The US law Musk violated would be the Logan Act...
Musk needs to be charged with war crimes along with his kremlin allies.
Maybe not war crimes, but definitely charges for directly attacking a sovereign state's military assets while engaged in an active operation. There has to be something in international law about this sort of behavior. Well, maybe not, since the ability for a single citizen to have the power to directly attack an entire military action is unprecedented. Seriously, what is stopping him from jamming any signal he wants if he can manage this? Will a full constellation be able to suppress wifi over a large area? Cell towers? Standard radio signals? Would it be able to be selective?
This action of his constitutes a privately owned and operated military-grade weapon which actually threatens even the super powers.
I really hope Mr free speach doesn't do anything about this scathing entirely accurate tweet about what an egoistical monster Elon is posted on the platform Elon owns.
It's also not a mistake when we know he's buddy buddy with Russia. We know why they did it.
Do we know what the details of the DoD contract outlined in terms of services provided? Musk seems to be retorting that the service was never meant to escalate conflict in the war, but I'd be curious what is actually on paper.
Can you imagine the DoD signing a contract that literally blocks Ukraine from taking back territory that's been occupied by Russia? Eventually Russia would occupy the entire country because Ukraine could never strike back. IMO Musk is a lying SOB.
I don't have a lot of knowledge in the subject to suppose, but I would think if this was a violation of the contract, the DoD contracts team would be litigating with Elon and slapping him with a fine. Considering we haven't heard anything (yet) it sounds like to me it wasn't a violation of the terms. I'm not an Elon fan the slightest, but I have worked with the US government in the past and the SoW or whatever is in the PO is what is the required deliverables. As much as I also want Ukrainian independence, I have not seen anywhere that defines Starlink for offensive purposes. The contracts team at DoD is probably equally to blame if they didn't outline the conditions that Starlink has to operate.
Yes: this happened before any contract with the DoD, so the terms of service were "none".
It’s because Elon finds Putin more relatable than the people Putin is attacking.
Not really. He's just afraid that his satellite constellation will get targeted by the Russians. They probably threatened him and he being who he is (attached to his companies) started to cave.
Plausible but wouldn’t they already be a target at this point, and to counter wouldn’t this have been a known risk when he signed the contract with the US Government on providing the coverage for Ukraine?
Not only a fraud, but also a terrorist support.
Don’t forget a disgusting billionaire, authoritarian, hater of his own children, and a fascist
Oh and sexual abuser, can’t forget that one
There's a good chance Putin is richer than Musk....just saying. And since there is that chance, what are the chances Putin has money in Musk's various businesses?
Starlink fails if Russia or any other country decides to shoot down its satellites. That’s enough reason for musk to be a patsy of any government that threatens to do it.
If one state starts shooting down satellites, they're going to get their own ones targeted and it only ends when neither has any satellites left. That's not a box anyone is willing to open.
I'm pretty confident that Musk has insurance for that. They can't shoot down enough of them to make a big difference, you may have a hole but the network will be ok.
So that constitutes a war crime at this point, correct?
Nope.
Either elon is a ficking idiot or has Russian allies
Bourgeois solidary does not know national borders.
Both? He's been trying to meddle and play "peacekeeper" this entire time. Except his version of peace is. Let the Russians keep everything they've taken, take the L and deal with it so I can continue to sell products and services there.
As a fan of some of Musk’s technical vision and how he’s revolutionizing society, I stringly believe he’s an effing idiot. People have given him so much praise, adulation, money, that he thinks he’s right and is easy to manipulate.
He’s a sucker who should go back to what he’s good at. Step back from the war and attempts at diplomacy, put Twitter on fire sale to someone who can fix it, and go back to your core. Let’s get cyber truck and semi out in force. Let’s deliver Roadster v2 and get to work on that rumored $25k cybercar. Let’s continue the revolution. Let’s get Starship/Superheavy flying, and continue through to Mars. Let’s continue the revolution of humans stepping out into the solar system. While he’s at it, it’s time to bail on some of the less successful sideshows. Stop wasting time and money trying to make a go of residential solar: great idea but if you can’t deliver something people can adfird, it’ll never work
There must be some way of charging him. Not that it’d stick, but I gotta think there’s some law that was violated, right?
By the books he should have to register as a foreign agent, and should be penalized for not doing so before engaging in foreign agent activity.
There is. His actions are against the law and he can be charged. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan_Act
At least $100b
My favorite was seeing a comment where someone said "i'm not going to believe the words of some dude trying to sell a book"
At this point I am now cheering for his rockets to expose on the launch pad.
B-b-but Elon wouldn’t want to get involved in war!! Aside from all the ways he’s involved himself in the war….
Jfc
It sounds sort of like Elon Musk, a private citizen, just committed conspiracy to perpetuate war crimes. That's a pretty serious accusation with grave penalties that is somehow not being prosecuted.
Their deaths are on elons hands
He probably gets off from that.
Piss of Elon, now he takes away starling completely for Ukraine, giving Russia the edge they need
He has a contract with the DoD now, he won't breach it.
He didn't have a contract before... didn't breach it either.
If he did that he would become an open enemy of the state. Which means starlink would become propriety of the USA gov?
For anyone interested in posting to this community, please keep rule 6 in mind. This post will be kept up because of the valuable discussion and activity that came with this post, but please mind the rules in the future. Thank you (:
Will try to remember to check the rules of each community before posting. Added a link to a news article. Thanks for the heads-up.
No problem. Thank you for responding (:
that's why we cannot trust billionaires and big corporations
musk is just a cooker with money
I wonder what would happen if a national intelligence agency was tasked with eliminating a billionaire. Could private security, however sophisticated, really deflect assassination attempts from a state? That has nothing to do with Elon Musk, though. He is way too beloved and cherished to ever become a target.
On the one hand, we have "reaper" missiles that are basically flying guillotines, that can strike with enough accuracy to kill a particular person in a particular car seat while not harming the other occupants.
On the other hand, how many times did we fuck up killing Castro?
We have entered the out loud part of billionaire gangsters literally taking over the world or trying. Elon dreams of an authoritarian world where he can house his workers a la Foxconn. Honestly someone is going to star popping these malignant ghouls soon and Elon is a prime candidate. One special ops team and a MANDAP and no more X.
We now live in an overt oligarchy heading toward fascism. Although it's always been an oligarchy behind the scenes IMO, you are right, they are now saying the quiet part out loud. They are also taking actions that were once done behind closed doors right out into the open.
David Frum: "If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy."
We are watching that happen. An oligarchy run by a fascist would be just fine with conservatives as they're showing us every single day.
Frank Wilhoit: “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition… There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”
Laws clearly do not bind Trump, Thomas, Roberts, Alito or Musk and they're done pretending that they do. They don't even bother playing lip service to the idea that we have a government of laws, not of men.
I once had a Mexican friend tell me "I weep for my country" when talking about Mexican crime. Watching the Republican's accelerating mockery of our laws, institutions and government I'm sorry to say that as an American I weep for mine.
Ukraine special ops downs Elmos jet....
Lol whats next? Elon Musk caused the war.
Starlink wasn't enabled in that region to begin with.
Lol! That's why disabling it prevented Ukraine from launching an offensive, right?
In the CNN article I read they say musk was specifically asked to expand the network for the operation. It seems like a weird spin.
He did not disable it, he refused to enable it in that region.
He did not disable anything, he refused a foreign (Ukrainian) request to enable it, that was contrary to his country's (US) stance at that moment: sanctions forbidding him to provide any service over Russia or Russian assets.
Stop blaming your weaknesses on others. don't get into a war you can't win. no one owes you nothing
So Ukraine should do what when they're attacked?
Surrender and comply to their brothers /s
his dudes opinion brought to you by the cooked shit he got told to think
Get fucked, Russia apologist.
Russia started the war you fucking donkey.
Real quick: What do you think the DoD contract that Starlink won from the Pentagon specifically for Ukraine is about?
Think? He's not paid to think
There was no DoD contract at the time. Should've paid the guy sooner.
Musk has been talking to Putin and it is clear he is taking instructions from him.
No matter how much it bothers you, this is news.
Could you please cite some sources, as per rule 8 (:
How is that clear?
"it shall approach the government and that government shall guide the company".
Are you writing up a manifesto or something lmao
Why are you lying in your post title
Whoops, it seems you accidentally posted here instead of a maga site, like Russian supported Parler.
I'm not even going to check what it is, but kbin.projectsegfau.lt sounds like a sketchy place.
In what way are Podolyak's words not being accurately paraphrased in the headline?
Nationalize his assets and deport him to South Africa
Tesla was built off the backs of the US taxpayer. It's so crazy to me that he's too dumb to realize being a toxic right winger is bad for business. He gets tax payer funds from the Democrats, his customers definitely skew left of center. I always thought Tesla was insanely over valued, but with all his bullshit and the major car manufacturers giving them competition now Tesla is bound to collapse...
Xesla has shaved $40k of the MSRP of their top end models since January.
I wonder why that is?
Yeah but in the era of supply side economics, selling bullshit to shareholders is what matters. The product is unimportant, what the shareholders think other shareholders think about the future of the product is what's important to a business now.
Shareholders skew right (some psychotically so when you consider the Saudis), and that's who Musk is selling bullshit to.
He did it to shore up support from manchildren since like 3 of his sex scandals hit the news in one week.
I wouldn't be opposed to a law change where if a company that takes subsidies breaks the law, the state can nationalize it at no cost. That would solve a lot of issues.
Being a "toxic right winger" is actually the requirement to do business in capitalism.
South Africa is where his families money is from and he can still have power there.
Guantanamo Bay is where he belongs
Send him to that big garbage island in the Pacific.
Nah, we don't want him either
Or extradite him to Ukraine.