The best thing you can do for the fediverse is just be kind

Here are some more specific examples to think about!
Compliment people's art and ask about their process
Teach people about something you're knowledgeable on
Give constructive criticism on peoples projects when it's welcome
Thank people for posting things you're glad you got to see, tell them you enjoyed it
Tell people you're glad they're here
Tell people you hope they have a good day
Thanks for taking the time to read my thoughts :) if you have thoughts of your own, I'd love to hear them!
- On constructive criticism - definitely rule one is make sure that it's invited first, but second, the best way to "sweeten" a critique and make it more appealing is to put it between compliments. Don't have a bare remark about the problems or suggestions, tell them what you like first, then how they might change things, and then close with something else positive or simply thanking them for sharing it. Even if someone says they want to hear what people think, it's normal to be defensive, so help lower that reaction first, and then leave them feeling appreciated even though you pointed out issues you saw.
  
  Aka the compliment sandwich. A technique I personally dislike. Be honest and open with your feedback in a positive way, don't try to hide it between compliments. If your feedback is simply negative, keep it to yourself.
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compliment_sandwich
  
  Absolutely agree, some folks just wanna share, some folks wanna get constructive crit to try and technically improve! Its important to be respectful of what kind of interaction folks are looking for :)
  And absolutely, talking about both good and bad doesn't just make it less unpleasant or more enjoyable to get feedback, it also makes better, more helpful feedback! (Assuming that's a thing they're looking for)
- I'm not one for religion, but I for one would like to join the Church of Cris.
- Are you open to some additional thoughts / feedback on feedback / constructive criticism?
  
  I am! Thank you for asking :)
  Ive gotten a lot of assumptions about what I meant and that's a bit frustrating but I really value honest sincere dialogue, if you have thoughts you think would be worth sharing I'd love to hear them my friend!
- Have a great day :)
  
  Thank you! You too 😊

There was a movement in the blogging community ~15 years ago to leave positive comments on posts you like. It was an approach to conquer negative comments and a general destructive nature of online conversations. I still do it to this day. If I really like something or appreciate someone's work, I leave a nice comment.
- Oh neat, being younger there's a lot of how folks approached the web in its earlier years that I don't have any experience with, and think there's a lot to learn from
  I love that!
- A nice comment is worth more than 1000 upvotes, emotionally.

I've noticed most discussions i have here end with a LOT less anger and a LOT more learning and that makes me happy.
- Fuck yeah! I think that's the thing that makes the fediverse special :)
  We all care enough about the online spaces we choose to inhabit that we leave the big platforms for something kinder. I think that's worth leaning into :)
  
  100%
  Internet by the people, and for the people, truly.
- Because there's fewer foreign bots trying to make you hate everyone in your country, and fewer social media engagement bots trying to make sure you stay online arguing with someone.

I disagree with your premise.
It should be "The best thing that you can do for humanity is to be kind".
Seriously. We're living in a time when fascism is in an upswing and at least one religious leader has publicly called empathy a sin. Kindness and empathy are rebellious acts.

Great post.
To add to this, not resorting to calling others tankies or Russian bots when you have differing opinions, especially around politics.
- I came to Lemmy (lemm.ee originally) with this attitude. Tankies really made me regret trying to be sympathetic too them. It was the most vile interaction I've had on the Internet maybe? You shouldn't call people tankies if they're not but real tankies are by far the biggest problem with the fediverse and it's growth
  
  yeah i've met some thorough tankies recently and wow are they annoying. just completely blind to reality.
- 1 billion percent agree, not everyone you disagree with is acting in bad faith
  
  when you're dealing with fundamentalists or extremists things turn nasty very quickly because you're questioning their fantasy world
  doesn't matter if they're good or bad faith, often they will just ban you
- On Reddit, I once bragged about having universal healthcare and got called a Nazi and a communist at the same time.
  This is what happens when Xbox kids that use the n-word grow up. They learn new "bad" words and throw them around out of context and contradictingly. They don't actually know what those things are, though, so it never makes sense.
  I've been called a tankie here. I didn't know what it was and looked it up, just to discover it was the literal opposite of the things I was saying. I was very confused and just put it down to frustrated self-projection. At some point they had been called that, it upset them, so now they use it to upset people too but they still don't actually know what it is they're saying.
  If I see someone defaulting to Russian bot or tankie, I've found another Xbox kid and it's in my best interests to just move on.
- Instance admins have pretty good information at their disposal to identify bots.
  I have yet to see any instance admin say that there is any significant amount of bots, outside of the occasional spate of spamming. I only see such theories & accusasions come from non-admins, with no accompanying compelling evidence.
  
  well the good news is that everybody - and that includes the US - creates psyops all the time, so that makes it fair.
  
  I've had the thought that if I were to design a psyop campaign, a pretty solid option for dominating the discussion would be to come out swinging and accuse everyone else of being an agent. That way, people have to either constantly defend against accusations, or they conclude, rightly, the accusations are baseless and decide to disregard the very idea that there is a psyop going on.
  
  I could be wrong but to me it feels odd to think lemmy is big enough to be worth organizing psyops for.
  Not to say it couldn't be an issue in the future, but it feels much more likely that people expressing pro Russia sentiment are just people who bought into that particular brand of propaganda.
  Which like, to some extent all of our individual world views are shaped by the environment of propaganda we're exposed to. We're all products of our social conditioning, and ultimately that's exactly what propaganda is. Media designed to socially condition people to a certain set of beliefs. All we as individuals can do is be aware of it and be willing to look at our own beliefs critically.
  But at the end of the day I think the folks praising Russia on lemmy are just people. People I personally think are misguided, but I don't think theyre generally acting in bad faith any more than the general population here.
- Sometimes they literally just are. Not seen it on Lemmy but on Reddit I definitely interacted with users, age under 1 year, all suspiciously pro-Putin. It's rare and I'm looking for it, but still.
  
  It's rare and I'm looking for it
  Unfortunately not that rare of a POV to find. They just generally don't do the young account thing. Some are true believers. Others likely state actors. Don't see as many bots but the greater levels of transparency and lower active population probably makes it less worthwhile of an investment.
- Nah fuck tankies, zero tolerance for the intolerant.

The second best thing is remember that tolerance of intolerance breeds intolerance.
- This is a whole different train of thought (mine is, I won't speak for yours) and I don't wanna derail my original thought but that's a thing I've been thinking about a lot lately.
  I agree with you, and subscribe to the idea of tolerance as a social contract that, once broken, is no longer owed to the one who broke the contract.
  At the same time, I've also learned that very explicitly, feeling persecuted is a requisite ingredient in radicalizing people into hate groups. And that at an individual scale, it's generally undeserved compassion that helps deradicalize them. We know this from the accounts of people who managed to leave hate groups- a little while ago there was really good (and long) interview with someone who used to be leader of a white nationalist group where he talked a fair bit about that idea, since he now works with a nonprofit that helps families and friends support and deradicalize loved ones, but it's far from the only account
  At present I'm really not sure how I personally reconcile those two things I belive to be true. The Nazi bar analogy is real.
  I know wading into this more specific conversion runs the risk of immediately derailing what I was trying to start a discussion about, but I figured I'd share my thoughts. If anyone reads this and has thoughts to share (though I'd prefer not to get 50 comments just saying I suck for having complicated views on what we do about the predicament the US and world is in with the rise of fascist ideology. I'm interested in what's effective in terms of fixing the problem just like you are) I'd be interested in hearing them. I'm still looking for a way to synthesize my beliefs into a coherent whole.
  Edit: thought I'd add the interview for anyone curious. I don't see everything exactly the way he does but I think understanding the problem and exactly how it works is necessary of we're going to address it, and I think his account is a really useful glimpse into certain aspects of how that world works
  
  I agree with everything you said at the top and this comment as well. You don't have to be mean, cruel, or shitty to the bad actors. In fact the best case scenario is to make your case once and then walk away. It's much easier to talk about than to actually do, but it's really effective. If you assume they're not trolls or bad actors, even better. All of these actions curtail flame wars, which is what they're after anyway if you're correct that they're a bad actor or troll.
  
  they're going to "feel" persecuted, no matter what. might as well make them actually fucking fear it.
- I think part of pleasantness is not bringing politics into things that weren’t intended to be about politics.
  
  The problem is politics impacts everything and the word "political" means different things to different people.
  To some, talking about being gay is political, even though to people who are in that community, it's literally just talking about their lives.
  
  To interject with a somewhat pedantic point, nothing is truly apolitical. But there is something to be said about sensing the proper time and place to start a political argument.
- i think if someone's intolerant, pointing out that they're wrong is something appropriate, but picking a fight over it is not worth it. it makes you like that person in that meme:
  edit: in bad cases, report it and move on with your life.
- Call them out so that resistance is visible, then block them to remove their agency to engage you.
- That suggests we should be intolerant of intolerance, which is an oxymoron.
  
  Almost as if the statement is referring to the paradox of tolerance.
  By allowing people like Nazis, Christofascists, Tankies, etc. a platform, it only invites more sharing that view to spread their bullshit around. This makes those that don’t share those extremist views uncomfortable they then leave those places. You see it on platforms like Truth Social, X, and 4Chan.
  If this is to be a kind place, we must encourage kindness and rid ourselves of unkindness. You can’t tolerate intolerance, lest it spread and take over.
  
  it's only an oxymoron if you're a moron. tolerance is a social contract. the intolerant break that contract and are no longer to be protected by it.
  
  Not really. Nazis are scum and deserve to be kicked out.
  
  Paradox of Tolerance - Karl Poppler - 1945
  It's a shame that something we already figured out 60 years ago still needs to be learned by most people.
  The good news is, this is an opportunity for you to grow and be better right now. It's never too late to improve yourself.
  
  Sure, if you think of it as purely semantic, or a zero sum game with no nuance, but it's not.
  Gotta be intolerant of those being needlessly cruel to those just trying to live their lives, and gotta be tolerant of those just trying to live their lives that don't affect you, even if you find it cringey.

I disagree, yes being kind is very important but even more important is people engaging and upvoting comments.
Reddit was great because of what happened in the comment section, not the headliners, and I see very little voting engagement even in active posts.
Remember, it's free to do and it encourages others to engage as well. But yea be kind too
- Voting is boring. Just comment yourself. Thats much better. We want content and discussions, Not just numbers;)
  
  Did you not see the part where I actually commented myself?
- @Angry_Autist@lemmy.world
  @Cris_Color@lemmy.world
  It is only "free" if you choose not to pay. Unlike commercial social that's free for you to use BECAUSE you are the product being sold, federated social is only free to you because someone else is paying.
  I completely agree that mass adoption requires well primed communities which requires early adopters to put more effort into engaging.
  I would also add that clicking on anything linked helps too.. Many news outlets are data driven. If you want them to invest more with federated social, click the links so the engagement shows up in their analytics.

I have a couple of suggestions to add:
I was considering leaving the other site before the API fiasco because it felt like so many users approach engagement as rhetorical combat, that is, the point of discussion is to defeat the other person. Instead, think one of Covey's habits of highly-effective people: "Win-win, or no deal." Approach discussion on the Fediverse as a collaborative act, in which you're exchanging ideas with another person. Even if you disagree, you can both win by respectfully hearing out the other person. And if the other person won't collaborate? No deal! Just disengage.
Just like in intimate relationship, use "I" statements instead of "you" statements. Telling people who they are and what they believe is not only disrespectful, but probably wrong, often exaggerated or distorted for rhetorical combat purposes. People get angry when their identity gets poked at. One exception, of course, is when giving advice, like, stick to what you know, and share your thoughts and your reactions to a topic.
- Well yeah but consider that everyone that doesn't think like me is a Nazi at best

I'll add: "be supportive and helpful if you can, and just shut up if you can't".
Fediverse is sometimes suffering from the same kind of people that Linux has - "oh you have a problem? Well, here's the GitHub repo and a project Wiki, figure it out".

Most people know this in some capacity, but it's not talked about enough: the shape of the platform massively shapes its culture. Every mechanism, intentional feature or not, is a factor in resulting user behavior and should be accounted for.
Reddit Karma was (shitty) reputation from the start, but Slashdot user IDs became one despite being mere sequential identifiers; negative user feedback such as downvotes can be harmful to communities (yet, users without an outlet may lash out in other ways e.g. reports); even how the platform communicates with users influences them; and so on.
I'm not saying you shouldn't be nice and incentivize others to do the same, but unless the system naturally leads to the desired behavior, you'll have a bad time in the long term because building culture by interactions doesn't scale. By the time you realize there's a shift, it's too late; interactions will compound and affect how the average user acts faster than you can try to course-correct.
I wish lemmy was more experimental, because by building a clone of reddit, we've copied too many of its faults. We've already got gatherings to complain about mods, and the one time devs considered changing a core component, discussion was killed by an onslaught of users. Problems with the current setup that were brought up then will likely never see that amount of people thinking about how to solve them.
Contrast with Mastodon, which gets crap for not being a faithful copy of twitter, but their reasoning for not including quote-reblogs is understandable. They're now putting a lot of thought into how to add them safely. Not ignoring functionality users want, but also not ignoring how it will affect culture, that's compromise.
I'd like it if we could talk more about how our platforms work and, particularly, how they affect us, because that's a big way we can build better platforms, right up there with being nice.
- People were right to be angry about removing voting visibility.
  The surest sign a community is toxic is voting patterns and removing our access to that removes our ability to combat the continuing enshittification of lemmy.
  And there are many, many mods that need to be complained about.
  Though you are right that no-nuance upvote/downvote is a really shitty metric
- I 1000% agree, the design of the space we inhabit shapes our behaviour.
  I don't think collectively we can stop at intentionally being kind, but forming a coherent design vision to effectively shape human behaviour and social outcomes as a community project is HARD and legitimately takes an actual vision and understanding of incredibly advanced design cobcepts very few have the experience to have any realy expertise in. Still important, but I think this is an easy way everyone can contribute. Similar to making donations.
  They're not the only things we need, but they're a small thing that becomes valuable when the culture decides we collectively prioritize them.
  You couldn't possibly be more right though. Erin kissane has talked a fair bit about that idea in her research. If there are specific design features of Lemmy you wish were different I'd be curious to see discussion posts on this comm about how we can design a space that facilitates more compassionate interactions and healthier community! (Or just to hear about them from you if they're not fully formed enough yet to post about :)
  
  I don’t think collectively we can stop at intentionally being kind, but forming a coherent design vision to effectively shape human behaviour and social outcomes as a community project is HARD and legitimately takes an actual vision and understanding of incredibly advanced design cobcepts very few have the experience to have any realy expertise in.
  Yeah if you want to get a PHD in this stuff, but you could also just become friends with a bunch of artists and ask them how they like this place, and notice how they talk about it feeling free and vibrant or dead and dying.
  By the way, we are already doing this work and it barely feels like we are... because the work is a basic product of the world views, shared values and shared explicit ideological and practical goals of this community space.
  You don't need this crazy apparatus to make this place a vibrant garden, having expert gardeners is definitely helpful, but it is about getting out of the way of kindness and empowering kindness, not coming up with some grand unified strategy to manipulate people into being better humans.
  Basic things like the way a lot of Mastodon instances don't by default prioritize showing the precise number of likes a post has add up to a significant difference in how healthy a social network is for the people in it. You can encourage people to obsess over unhealthy aspects to communication by making the numbers front and center, encouraging people to associate popularity and self worth with those numbers, and creating situations where everybody has to become an expert in gaming getting the best numbers possible even in the realm of their personal life (or so we are made to feel).... or you can de-emphasize the numbers and make it a thing people can check if they want to, but the UI and general philosophy of the place doesn't really encourage or worship that kind of thinking in the first place so why bother?
  The reason it feels weird not to have numbers quantifying how successful a social media post/piece of content is that the people who designed these systems were programmers not artists, they didn't understand the incredible farce that attaching the atoms of communication in a community with direct quantification is... would immediately lead to unhealthy environments, they just saw it as the easiest way to make money and identify who the valuable influencers to pay to do ads are.
- What if we had a tribunal instead of moderators? Actually just in the time it took me to write that out I could see it going terribly wrong LMAO
  
  The point of this system isn't to centralize control under moderators, this isn't some bug to iron out or a duct-tape solution that is meant to be temporary until we can figure out how not to centralize power.
  The point of this system is to encourage communities to create an explicit shared set of values, those values have to be attached to a specific community and thus that community will then have specific people tasked with dealing with grey areas and problems that occur when people don't adhere to the values.
  People need to stop focusing on the moderators and focus on what it means to be explicit with a positive step forward about proclaiming the kinds of values you want to hold in a shared community space. THAT is what gives this place such immense power to shape the world.

the second best thing you can do is to make nsfw posts
- Lol. Porn does make the internet go round
  I already did that, but not on this account >.>
  
  Multiple accounts are a must!
  ...or so I've been told
  
  expose your fetishes
  now
  you have no choice
  
  something about that oily wetness lubricating the engine of thought.
  
  I thought it was more 'up and down' :)
  Can people see what groups you subscribe to on Lemmy?
- Make any post of quality. More high quality posts reducing reasons for visiting reddit the better

Fuck you!

Unless you're a republican or other type of nazi. Then you can absolutely go all the way to hell.
Tolerance got us here.
- Nazis can always join their own defederated server and have their little circle jerk, nothing is stopping them from going and joining exploding heads; they don't have a right to be part of federated fediverse and have their bullshit heard.
  For that matter, nothing's stopping the people who disagree with me from creating their own nazi-friendly Lemmy instance. This is not the Nazi bar, and it's not going to be, so go ahead and open it yourselves. No need to let me know how it turns out, I'm pretty sure I've got a good guess.
  
  like Truth social
- Generalizing is a logical fallacy. Not all Republicans are Nazis.
  Some are rotten. Some are good people that just got duped.
  It's not black and white.
  
  Nope. They've had plenty of time to see the results of their actions. They're complicit at this point.
  
  If you’ve been getting duped for 50 years, then maybe you’re just too stupid to vote. People with a bit of a plant in their pocket have been disenfranchised for a lot less
- Except the non-US republicans, they're cool :D
- It’s not about tolerance imo, it’s about discussion. You’d be surprised to learn their reasoning if you actually listened to it. You don’t have to agree with it.
  Both sides have this problem right now. Both only converse with their own. Why are republicans not changing? Well if their friends, family and everyone they talk to is a republican, they’ll never be exposed to different opinions.
  Don’t forget that both sides can have valid policies depending on how you view the world. I’m not taking about trump and whatever you people are doing out there in the US, but in general, conservatism is the idea that people will manage their money, rather than the government.
  Look at Quebec for example. A very socialist government. 2 years ago they invested a ton of money into one electric bus company. Well that company failed really bad and while they aren’t completely bankrupt, they aren’t far. It’s easy then to then see why conservatives would want to vote conservative. If their money had stayed in their pocket instead of going to the government, this wouldn’t have happened.
  Same thing with health. The public health system is currently clogged up so a lot of people end up having to pay to go to the private sector to actually get cured in time. So conservatives believe this whole system is a huge waste of taxpayer money. Most conservatives I know aren’t agaisnt the government helping with that, but they’d rather the government just pay the invoice after you went to a private clinic, similar to insurance in the states, rather than try to control a system that clearly isn’t working.
  
  You’d be surprised to learn their reasoning if you actually listened to it.
  Turns out their reasoning a lot of the time is divinely ordained racism and sexism. Turns out thats been the reasoning behind a lot of humanity's choices.
  
  I'm not interested in the reasoning behind bigotry.
- Ik a few people who lean to the right economically but aren't in favor of all this authoritarian stuff And they're not Nazis, you cant just generalize so broadly about what should or shouldn't be tolerated. Ofc if someone is being blatantly racist that shouldnt be tolerated, but economic discussion is totally fine
  
  Turns out Republicans social and economic policiy is dogshit. There are three types of Republicans; power hungry sycophants, cultural chameleons that dont care but to blend in, and then the largest proportion... salt of the earth morons.
  
  Electing republicans is in itself blatantly racist.
- Lol the irony
  
  The nazis during WW2 were defeated with love and kindness 🤗
  (lol no, we shot them to death)
  
  Zero irony. Nothing funny here. Nazis fuck off. Republicans fuck off. Trumpers fuck off.

The last time I went to Reddit, I felt like everyone was trying to pick a fight, and would jump on me for any tiny reason.
No point being part of a community like that, the whole place is a dumpster fire, but if everyone is either trolling or turning on each other, it's much worse.
I hope as Lemmy gets more popular, it doesn't inherit those problems.
- I think as early members of this small online space we have to potential to cement a kinder culture that can influence even what this platform is like many years from now, with users that won't be here for a long time!
  People tend to match energy with the people they're engaging with. When you show people kindness they intuitively respond the same way, and when that's the culture, I think it can profoundly shape people's social behaviors :)
  And this space being as small as it is, we all have an outsized impact on that culture compared to something like reddit where any given user makes up such a teeeeny tiny fraction of the social interaction there.
  We can all create that kind of culture that leads with kindness and prompts others to follow suit
- I used to use reddit constantly, and did so for years. That level of hostility took over so gradually that I didn’t even consciously notice. I used Lemmy for a few weeks before it really sunk in that nobody had jumped down my throat over a minor, irrelevant issue (like a careless punctuation or grammatical error).
  People here tend to give each other the benefit of the doubt, which had become virtually unheard of on reddit. Even when people make replies I don’t agree with, they’re usually discussing the point rather than the way that point is presented.
  I will never, ever go back.
- I'd say there's also some corners of Lemmy that feel like the slightest provocation leads to an absolute dog pile of people being super angry looking for a fight.
  That aspect blows but it's usually helped by making sure that the instance your account is on is federated (or specifically NOT federated) with specific other instances.
  Though this place is so much more chill than Reddit it's fucking mindblowing
- I swear Reddit has bots/trolls/AI designed to argue and rile you up to increase engagement. We see it in reposts/titles, why not in the comments?

I see you around a lot, and you're consistently doing exactly this. I really respect that.
- Thank you very much, I do my best :)
  By the way I love your username lol. Take care!

OP simply asks people to be kind, People proceed to tear each other apart..
OP now knows how Jesus felt 🤣
- Or how Doctor Who felt after asking the master for help.
- i gotta lead by example. I gotta lead by example. Lead By Example. IM GONNA LEAD BY EXAMPLE 🥲🙃
  we're doin our best out here lol. But that's what it takes! There is no perfect, no "I literally never make mistakes" or "never let my frustration dictate shitty behaviour when compassion would yield the outcome I want"
  You gotta decide you care more about what's effective than how good it feels to act on your anger, and then you gotta do your best :)
- That'll do it

The thing that I appreciated most about Lemmy and my transition from Reddit is how cordial everyone has been. Even if a comment is taken out of context, people tend not to jump down each others throat and assume the worst, or make bad faith arguments full of fallacies. I've had legitimate back and forths with people, something that basically never happens on Reddit.

I arrived at LEMMY after what I think we very optimistically called the Reddit Collapse. We wish. And I had toe in LEMMY and a few others at Reddit.
Recently with their abusively patronizing redesigning and gamification and just ugly bullshit, I can’t stomach Reddit at all. So LEMMY grows increasingly important, not just to me but to folks who haven’t yet even heard of it.
So, I’ll just say thanks for your post here. I have, I confess, engaged with a couple bullies on LEMMY and I always try to say… I don’t like to do this on LEMMY— and I say that precisely for the reasons you mention.
And as you encourage: I will try to be kinder, even in when feeling… hmm… less than kind.

Kinda wish we could pin this post to the top of everyones feed for a while! 😅 Lemmy has been a great place so far but think we can do even better. Especially with the points you bring up.
Thanks for sharing 😊
- ❤️ thank you!

Hey this is a nice post, I wonder what the comments say :3 click
"Oh you think being kind is good? You're a fascist OP >:T. You can't make me vote republican"
- im having a time. 🥲
  
  I can imagine x3 clicking on this gave me mental whiplash
- If I steal your identity I can make you vote republican. But I don’t like to steal. Maybe: lend it to me? I promise to give it back at the end.
  
  Im not a US citizen (or a citizen of any other country that has a republican party), so that may be more work than you're signing up for on your end.. getting a citizenship can take ages :3
- I'm glad there's still sane people here.

As I get older I have found that making my world smaller and focusing on the things I genuinely care about (and not the things I’m “supposed to” care about as a “good” man/American/worker etc) results in me being happier and more satisfied with life.
Lemmy is my close little corner of the internet. I hope that the fediverse grows ands takes over for the good of other people, but if it stays in this niche for another decade I’ll be happy because I already love it for what it is.

One thing that has been concerning me lately is that the Fediverse is being treated as a refuge for people who get banned on Reddit or other social media. Sure, sometimes those bans are based on arbitrary power tripping nonsense. But people actually do get banned for being assholes, and so I've got some worry that this is distilling the population of the Fediverse in an unfortunate direction.
- Yeah, I think that was a big issue with the culture of platforms like Voat.
  The fediverse doesn't have it as bad but it's still definitely a risk. And being decentralized makes it easier to dodge bans and whatnot.
  You're right, and like I said elsewhere in this thread, big corporate platforms definitely have issues but that doesn't mean there aren't any unique challenges the fediverse will have to contend with.
- Every troll server gets defederated from by everyone. And every troll gets banned on the normal servers. I think the federated nature is a blessing, those assholes have their own part of the internet which is usually far from my part of the internet.
  
  "Asshole" is a broad term. It includes racists, abrasive personalities, anger-management problems, and so forth. Ie, people who have a tendency to get banned from other places. It's not just trolls.
  Being banned from Reddit is a unitary action. They can't get back into Reddit, they're just gone. Whereas in the Fediverse you can just go to a different instance and sign up afresh each time you get banned. This is part of the Fediverse's design. And so I am concerned that the Fediverse will accumulate the worst users.

If I'm in a toxic mood, I go to reddit.

If this is the best thing you can do, then the second best thing is be active. We're still content starved around here. If you think of something to post, post it. If you can't post, try to comment. Especially on any post that has no comments. Doesn't matter how banal your comment is. Nothing scares away potential new users more than seeing post after post with 0 comments in their feed, and nothing disheartens posters more than that "0 comments" under their post.
People are generally scared or reluctant to do things when nobody else is doing them. They don't want to post in communities that don't already have recent posts. They don't want to comment on posts that have 0 comments. So whenever you can break that silence and be that first post or comment, try to do so.
- I definitely agree about the importance of breaking the silence, and engaging with folks who go out of their way to post.
  As a culture we want that to be rewarding, it's something we all appreciate when folks do, so I think it's worth making sure posters can feel that it's appreciated. Make it known :)

One my favorite ways to summarize this kind of thinking is with the Bill & Ted quote "Be Excellent To Each Other, and Party On Dudes" (mostly the first half applies to this post though). The part that applies to this post, Keanu Reeves said he interprets as follows:
I think that the sentiment of it is really just be the best person, the best human being you can be, and if you do that, then you can party on and live life to the fullest, but you’re gonna be safe... You’re going to be supported, you’re going to get the gift of giving, you’re going to get the gift of receiving, you’re going to get to the gift of sharing. We’re all just some humans on a rock in space, and so it’s kinda nice to kind of promote that idea of ‘give a little, get a lot’, kind of bring it in for a group hug."

Completely right OP, and this is worth repeating as MUCH as possible. More than almost any UX or intake changes, Fediverse will only grow if their experience of the community is good.
Unfortunately, some people have never caught a vibe in their life and it shows lol. A single person with a bad attitude can completely tank your experience in a small community, versus a 20,000 person subreddit where usernames are basically indistinguishable.
- some people have never caught a vibe in their life and it shows
  Lmao 😂
  And yeah, we actually have tangible evidence to support that idea Erin kissane has done a lot of incredible research work on how to effectively design the fediverse and support people in navigating it and one of the earlier things she did was interview people who left Mastodon after having bad experiences and collate that data-
  A lot of people's reasons is that when they joined they were met with hostility. It plays a huge role in people's experiences here, and even just from a purely pragmatic perspective it's REALLY important
  
  I feel like this conversation is slipping into equating "makes fediverse grow faster" to "good".
  Maybe most people need to have an initial experience where they get pushback for behaving the way they did somewhere else?
  That is of course a dangerous rationalization to apply, as it can be used for any kind of shitty treatment of people, but there is also a similar danger to assuming that whatever will bring people in the fastest is inherently good.

Love how the point of the post is “hey try to be nice” and everyone sounding off in the comments like “FUCK YOU AND FUCK THOSE SPECIFIC GUYS TOO”
Maybe more people should just post their reviews of vacuums here
- The vast majority of people here are reddit refugees, raised on a website that encourages being a prentious dick(me inclusive, too often, though I'm trying to be better) it's unsurprising they'd take issue with the message
- I have a shark vacuum, I don't know the model. It's really good for two reasons. First, it slides down low profile to go under things easily. Second, it has a three foot long detachable suck stick so you can get bigger stuff or get down in cracks. It's great for around the litter boxes. 4.5 stars because things could always suck more.
  
  Hell yeah thank you for your service
- Its definitely fatiguing not gonna lie 🙃
  Clearly I left it too ambiguous whether I meant Nazis specifically when I said you should try to approach people you disagree with with curiosity. That sounds super sarcastic but I don't mean it that way, I just don't have the energy to reword it
  This problem probably could have been anticipated and avoided, it's just hard to always do so perfectly on the internet when speaking to a lot of people you don't know who will interpret what you say in any manner of different ways
  
  There's a limit to how carefully you can word things to protect its meaning from people determined to read it in bad faith. I have it too - the desire to be long winded to preemptively protect myself from misunderstanding. But there's a risk that we'll turn everything we say into long blocks of soft useless mush. There's no precision precise enough to be safe.
  We have to, I think, decide to write for people willing to reach for us when we hold out a hand. There are enough willing to try that any general misunderstandings can be clarified with conversations other people can read if they want to understand. If enough of us are willing to do this for each other, it might be possible to build spaces where people who slap that outheld hand away don't have to dictate conversation. And maybe we can both be less wordy.
  
  Nah I think that what you said was legitimate and I don’t think you need to reword it. I’d rather be part of a social media experiment where there’s allowed to be some nuance and subtlety. Also I think you’ve made it pretty clear that nazi’s are excluded from the list of people to try to be nice to. I agree with you there!
- Sucky! sucky! five dolla!

Getting better at communication takes time and practice. Depending on where someone is in that journey, a post like this can make a big difference. And I think we can all use a reminder to be kind every so often. So, thanks for taking the time to write this out

A big problem is too much politics, feels like politics is always brought up even in posts where it's not the topic of discussion. Just look at this post. Then if someone disagrees with your view they'll attack you and then they'll claim they "are on the right side". People have forgotten the golden rule.
- It's very front of mind because these are the "interesting times" from the Chinese curse. Even people I've always known to say they don't pay attention to politics, can't watch the news it just makes me sad, etc. These people are talking politics every day. It's hard not to.
- I disagree, if political discourse can't survive public debate, then it isn't a very good political ideology.
  We have been artificially hampered on other platforms by having to be nice to the nazis, we don't have to do that here and I fully welcome such debate because none of their abhorrent ideologies hold up under scrutiny
  As for left leaning political debate, we have ALWAYS argued with each other. That is one of our greatest strengths that we just don't all into line with everything the top says. Also one of our greatest weaknesses.
  But to stifle that artificially will just force it to bleed into other discussions.
  I say up with political discourse and let the marketplace of ideas be conceptually free of bias and the results will be that humanity in general considers nazis pretty bad people
  
  disagree, if political discourse can’t survive public debate, then it isn’t a very good political ideology.
  They made it clear they're talking about spaces and topics not about politics. People who feel entitled and compelled to make everything a political culture war are insufferable. Made worse when they call everyone who disagrees with them a Nazi. The word has lost all meaning now.
- That's because politics are getting to the point where people cannot ignore them any longer. Think it's bad now? Just wait till the grocery gets hit.
- Dunno maybe you can subscribe to more instances (sublemmies? I don't know the lingo) and somehow filter out the ones that go bad quickly. My enjoyment of Lemmy went up by a lot once I started ignoring the front page and curating my subscribed instances. Just make sure you visit the list of communities every so often

This place is becoming very Reddit, if you post anything that deviates from someone’s beliefs they call you names and insult your intelligence. So many people can’t have a debate or discussion without jumping to personal attacks and hate. It’s really disheartening. I love political debate but there’s no such thing anymore, only name calling

Highly upvoted comments like "Elon Musk should commit suicide" or "X group of people are all mentally retarded" or even popular posts themselves make me feel uncomfortable.
It feels toxic like X. Or what Voat (an older Reddit clone, albeit not a federated one) turned into. So much of y'all upvoting posts like that, normalizing it, does not make me want to stick around, as that culture of hate will only get worse.
- I can definitely understand that. I think in a lot of ways that problem is driven by how much of a political echo chamber lemmy is. Any time there's a narower range of beliefs I feel like you can see those beliefs getting more extreme, or expressed in more extreme and toxic ways.
  I honestly don't really know how to improve it given the state of the world. It feels like the range of political beliefs keeps getting compressed into two groups and it makes it harder and harder to tolerate the beliefs of those further from yourself. And for valid reasons.
  And the more justified the contempt for people of other political views gets the harder it gets to figure out how, culturally, we manage the justified anger that comes from how deeply broken everything is.
  Elon musk is doing actual literal Nazi salutes and peoples anger about that is justified. And at the same time I'm not sure what way of acting on that anger (and acting on the problem) yields anything other than radializing people teetering on the edge of extremism.
  I'm glad I don't really see actual Nazis on lemmy. Its nice that there's less debate about the legitimacy of people's humanity.
  And at the same time anger is deeply toxic to healthy interaction and drives behaviors that I genuinely don't think make the problems prompting people's anger any better.
  Thank you for sharing your thoughts candidly, a lot of this thread is a love-fest and that's wonderful and puts a smile on my face, but it's at least as important to talk about the unhealthy aspects of the fediverse's culture
  
  Yeah don't get me wrong, I love Lemmy. But I don't like, well, that sort of thing. Or straight up disinformation being posted along the lines of that vitriol. It makes me worry about the Fediverse, as that culture only goes one place, and I feel like we shouldn't stick our heads in the sand and only talk about the love if the culture is getting radicalized to an extreme.
- It may not do much depending on the mods/admins, but it never hurts to report and downvote comments or posts like that.
  Emphasis on reporting there, as I think sometimes that stuff lingers around because people have made a habit of only downvoting and blocking those doing that regularly. I realize in your examples it's more likely bias or bigotry respectively, but still.
  Report first, then downvote and block. Doing only the latter only makes your experience a little better, the former may help the community.
  
  I do report them, but some communities seem to encourage it and leave it up.
  I guess I can block the community, but it's still affecting the "Lemmy culture" at large...
- people are very emotional rn because of everything that's happening but i agree with you that violence for it's own sake is never good. the discussion must stay positive.

The thing in this post about curiosity isn't just a lemmy/online thing.
The vast majority of people are mainly interested in themselves. Like - if you have trouble on dates, making friends, getting along at work, anything to do with people in general - approaching them with a sense of sincere curiosity will completely change things overnight.
Get people to talk about themselves, be supportive in your discussions with them, and shut the fuck up wherever possible and suddenly you're interesting, a good person, kind, whatever - traits you've done exactly fuck all to demonstrate, but that people will swear are true because you seem interested in them.
It's fucking bonkers but it's true. Curiosity can change your world.

Everyone's been really nice as long as I don't touch anything political - then it becomes a fart sniffing smug fest.

@Cris_Color@lemmy.world being nice helps establish the "tone", but I'm not sure that wouldn't change with another "API event" on Reddit that results in another, larger mass migration.
Another suggestion I have for college graduates is to ask your alma mater if they are going to start using something other than commercial social to engage with alumni.
Most universities don't want to make mistakes investing in the bleeding edge, but they are quick to follow. When a few schools do something, many more quickly copy that. They are also looking for low cost wins. Their engagement numbers are already telling them that Xwiiter no longer works to reach alumni or potential students.
If even a handful of alumni suggest a change at the right time, that is often enough to get them to give federated social a try.
That is when the less toxic "tone" really helps.

A lot of people dive in as if the entire fediverse has the same level of nerve as 4chan.
There are a lot of sensitive people here. The best thing I learned through my dealings with Mastodon is to be kind, and lurk before hitting that comment button.
The level of discord on the fediverse waxes and wanes depending where you are. There are conversations I'd never have here, that I'd gladly have elsewhere with no ill effects. The right words for the right group of people.
- "Sensitive" people can be really toxic too. Some people just enjoy being outraged.

Great post, as usual. Thank you for this!
- Thank you! ❤️

I don't miss the thousands of obnoxious, foul mouthed folks on FB that I routinely blocked. Haven't experienced any of that on the fediverse yet.

Also try to post stuff. I need to follow my own advice more.
- Baby steps! :) I found it helped me build the habbit if I kept an eye out for posts that could be cross posted to smaller more niche communities
  There are a lot of times where a post only gets posted on a bigger community because it has enough traffic, and smaller niche communities would benefit from folks crossposting it around!
  
  Yeah all good advice!
- And not just memes and shitposts you find elsewhere
  Make things and share
  It ain't gonna be perfect but that's half the fun

Upvote, comment, post! Compliment good OC content (especially if it is posted regularly).
Bring more regular users if you can.

I notice tons and tons of hostility in comments. And I think it's from people jumping to the worst possible conclusion.
- I knew that would happen, but you're not wrong 😅
  As I've alluded to, there's a lot of justifiable anger about the state of the world, and you can see that hurt reflected in people's immediate response. The feelings driving that "conclusion jumping" valid and understandable, even if I don't think it's productive
  There is no easy way to cope with fascism on your doorstep, or taking over your home and threatening to throw you out of it :(
  Originally I listed all the extra examples/suggestions I put in my comment in the actual post itself, but I have a bad habit of making things way too long so I moved all the smaller more specific things to the comment. I think maybe it would have been more clear I'm not saying you should approve of Nazis had they still been in the post.
- Yeah but have you thought how that makes you a Nazi

I hope you have a good weekend!
- Thank you my friend, you too!

Okay I agree, so let's start from Linux related any post, tell them if somebody asks a problem don't tell them just install mint , or how one is crazy because they are facing the problems in Linux or if you are not using Linux what idiot are you. I stopped participating because
Linux dude bros are just idiots troubling me
I can't find content which is though not niche is just is plain not news or Linux
It's very confusing to use fedverse as I don't know of i can go all subs via my boost app or do i need something else , if so where to access them.
So let's make it ACCESSIBLE, NON DERAGORTY FOR ANON LINUX USERS ALSO

I love this.
I think it’s important to say this doesn’t mean pretending you like or agree with something you don’t like or agree with.
But when you do see something you like, agree with, or appreciate, drop a compliment. Compliments make places better!
- Absolutely agree. Fake niceness is worthless and does nothing to make a space better.
  We need sincerity.

When I see small, I see potential. More people know each other which fosters genuine relationships and understanding, ingredients missing from the toxic environments of the big social networks.
My ex used to call me a very small dude with a big city attitude. She didn't mean it as a compliment, but I took it as one.
The fediverse is just a beautiful place to be you. It feels calm, relaxed, intellectual and full of supportive people. It's a refreshiong alternative to the sprawling and sometimes impersonal nature of vast social networks.
One thing we should all agree on, we all have a role to play in shaping the culture of this space.

I have also noticed people agreeing with someone in a reply to another comment, but the original commenter has no upvotes. If you agree, upvote. If you kind of agree, upvote. If you don't agree, but they make a good case, upvote and then say that. Upvotes make people feel good.
- Agree

I started using Lemmy just recently. I haven't seen any sexism here so far. On reddit it's a matter of minutes until something sexist appears on my feed, or other hateful stuff. That's why I feel way more relaxed using Lemmy.
- sexism does exist on lemmy but the algorithm is less aggressive about pushing rage-bait, so it rarely shows on the front-page. also, the people here are a bit more considerate, i'd say. but that is mostly because it's a lot of nerds here (heheh).
  
  Yes, that algorithm is definitely way better! I'd argue though that people aren't more considered here because they are nerds. Communities, such as the gaming and anime communities, are often one of the most misogynistic ones online. I think people are more considered here, because they are politically on the left.

Speaking past each other is IMO the biggest source of friction and division on the fediverse.

Agreed, love it!
- ❤️
  Have a good one!

i hope the quality stays up and i guess that we're non-commercial might help with this; as we're not pushing people to use this platform; the people here are people who actually want to use this platform and i guess that in itself could do a good thing.
- I wish too. Unfortunately, the redditors are coming here, and i've noticed a pretty big spike in racism/transphobia :D I've been trying to keep them on a leash, reporting them to other admins directly and banning them from dbzer0, but the attitude itself being there disappoints me heavily :/
  
  This unfortunately happens each time Reddit steps on a rake. They tend to come in waves.

Love this

Well I came here to chew bubblegum and talk shit, and I’m all out of bubblegum.

So I can't be myself?

On the one hand, yes, yes, yes, absolutely.
On the other hand, way too often people are absolutely vile here and nobody sticks up for themselves or for others. Really a shame that r-word-it bullshit behavior is often times totally accepted and approved and even rewarded here.

Sometimes being kind doesn't necessarily mean being nice.

Thanks for sharing! I'm not perfect at this, but I try to keep the vibes welcoming.
Lemmy's more intimate and understanding vibes are its best features IMO.
- Hell yeah 😊
  And I absolutely agree. Lemmy straight up isn't as big as reddit, it's important that there be stuff to see, but I think one of the best things about the fediverse is that it feels so much more like healthy, actual social interaction, and I think that's a strength we ought to celebrate and actively facilitate :)