Can you separate the artist as a person from the music?
Can you separate the artist as a person from the music?
For example, I personally can't listen to Guns and Roses without immediately thinking "that Axl sure is an asshole", and that sours the entire experience.
Nope.
Eric Clapton is an anti-VAX conspiracy theorist and a racist. Van Morrison is anti-VAX conspiracy theorist and a racist. John Lennon is a serial abuser drug addict, beat women and abandoned his own son. Steven Tyler from Aerosmith is a pedophile. Anthony Kiedis from the Red Hot chili peppers is a pedophile.
Etc.
Anytime I learned something horrible about someone famous, I write them off completely.
Wait, Anthony Kiedis!? That's news to me.
It was to me too, had to go looking - guessing this from Wikipedia is what it was:
Kiedis acknowledges in his autobiography Scar Tissue that he had sexual relations with a 14-year-old girl when he was 23, before and after learning of her age, in the 1980s. This inspired him to write the song "Catholic School Girls Rule".
Don't forget Ted Nugent helped funnel Russian money through the NRA for Trump and is a pedophile, Meatloaf is anti-vax, and Roger Waters openly supports Putin's actions in Ukraine.
Yup.
Don’t get me started on “Kid Rock”
Seems to me Waters has walked back that remark about Ukraine. His schtick is generally that he says provocative stuff that opposes western power structures, which sometimes causes him to overcompensate and say something in favour of, say, Putin.
I was at his concert last year and he was hardcore antifa, anti-supreme court, anti-establishment, anti-billionaires, anti-zionist, anti-nazi, pro-choice, and so on. Pictures of every U.S. president with the words "war criminal" captioning them. He seems like a class act to me.
Already didn't like Steven Tyler, but that's news to me.
Guess he'll never change my mind now.
In fairness to Eric Clapton, he did have an extremely rare life-threatening reaction to the vaccine. He may be off the deep end now, but I think at the time of recording Layla etc. he was a fine guy as far as I know.
Eric is a racist way before he was an antivaxer.
In 1976, on stage, Clapton praised Tory MP Enoch Powell, and declared that Britain must stop itself from becoming a “black colony,” and said “England is for white people, man.”
He went on to say:
“I don’t want you here, in the room or in my country. Listen to me, man! I think we should vote for Enoch Powell. Enoch’s our man. I think Enoch’s right, I think we should send them all back. Stop Britain from becoming a black colony. Get the foreigners out. Get the wogs out. Get the coons out. Keep Britain white. I used to be into dope, now I’m into racism. It’s much heavier, man. Fucking wogs, man. Fucking Saudis taking over London. Bastard wogs. Britain is becoming overcrowded and Enoch will stop it and send them all back. The black wogs and coons and Arabs and fucking Jamaicans and fucking… don’t belong here, we don’t want them here. This is England, this is a white country, we don’t want any black wogs and coons living here. We need to make clear to them they are not welcome. England is for white people, man. We are a white country. I don’t want fucking wogs living next to me with their standards. This is Great Britain, a white country. What is happening to us, for fuck’s sake?”
I mean, theres 3 categories for giving them a pass on their transgressions (as a fan, not legally or morally speaking) IMO.
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The art/performance was just so far beyond good that you cant deny the cultural significance. E.g Michael Jackson, Elvis, Tupac.
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You had a personal connection to the art before they did the shitty thing or before it came to light. (In my case: early Chris Brown, Kid Rock) They were big in my late teens and early 20s and I have positive memories associated with their songs. Not the percieved quality of the art.
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They had their day in court, did their time and time has passed. E.g Mark Wahlberg, I dont know the guy, I dont know if he is a good person or not these days. But the last documented occasion of him being a huge violent racist asshole is 1992... 32 years ago.
This is great. It's not perfect, but it's great. It feels like an impossible task but it feels more possible with a structure like this.
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Yeah I can. Gonna get a bit hippie on you here but it really comes down to how the art make you feel and not the artist. One personal example is jeepers creepers for me. I love that movie but victor salva is a POS that deserves to be castrated. Now another question you should ask yourself is the actual companies behind the media could be evil too, overworking their employees, underpaying them, etc..., are you going to stop watching it? A good example of this is the anime industry or some record producers
Yes. It's a basic skill you need to learn before you can even attempt to change our hellworld.
Generally I don't have a hard time separating the art from the artist. And it's probably bad and selfish, but if I had to stop listening to David Bowie, Eric Clapton, and John Lennon, I'd be so depressed. The world is deeply shitty, so I'm hanging on to whatever happiness I can find. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yeah, just do a little piracy
Originally I thought I could, but no. Because when I listen to the music, I'm giving that artist money, attention, and power.
That results in giving them a bigger platform to spew their bigoted opinions/actions is counterintuitive to my goals. I would rather not.
Yes, always.
So many musicians and other artists are not only complete assholes, but also complete morons. But, I don’t listen to their music for their antics or their intelligence, I listen for the music.
I still listen to Johnny Craig and the Lost Prophets even though I know how horrible they are in real life. Because to me, the music is about the feeling that it elicits in me, not about the creator. I don’t care who made a thing, I care about the thing.
Edit: that said, I’ve not purchased music by those two, and instead pirated it.
If it makes sense to consider the artist's actions and morality, it makes just as much sense to consider that of the producers et. al.
That leaves us with virtually no content tho.
Just today I wanted to show a friend UnDeadwood, a western horror one shot by the critical role crew, and learned they've removed ALL content with Brian W. Foster because he turned out to be an abusive piece of shit. I understand it on a certain level, but at the same time that's an INSANE amount of actually amazing content just gone because one dude turned out to be a piece of shit.
Fucking Pepe Le Pew is totally a creep! Absolutely does not get consent!
Yes. You listen to music without knowing anything about who wrote it and you feel something. That feeling has nothing to do with the composer or performer. Now if you find out the composer/performer is a "bad" person, I would recommend not giving them any money that could contribute to them spreading their "bad stuff". I'd still enjoy the music because your enjoyment isn't furthering their bad agenda.
I think it’s crucial…
I have to, otherwise I wouldnt listen to music at all...
There is so much music now, once I found out an artist doesn’t align with my values it’s easy to drop them.
I can live with artists having different views/believes/opinions, but when it comes to actions they did, then it's a different story for me.
E.g. I don't enjoy Rammstein anymore
Billy Corgan is that guy for me. He comes off as a total asshole in every interview I’ve listened to him give.
I'd imagine so but I don't currently listen to any artists that have done anything bad as far as I'm aware.
Depends on how parasocial I am. Never gave much of a shit about Win Butler as a person, so I don't really think about the shit he's gotten up to, but the several months when I thought Conor Oberst might be a rapist were devastating
Win's is still so tough to me. I read through each of the statements and my final thought was: he did some bad things, but nothing that's going to get him thrown in jail. Similar to Aziz Ansari if I remember correctly. Now whether or not punishment would be morally right is another discussion, obviously our legal system is Very Flawed.
Yes I do this very easily. I listen to music and don’t spend any time at all learning about the artists.
To an extent I can, like Axl is a complicated one given his mental health issues. Nothing excuses his behaviour but he seems to have grown as a person and managed to somewhat control his shittier side.
But there's definitely a line. I can't really enjoy rammstein or die antwoord anymore
If I liked them before I knew, yes. But if I knew going in, it’s hard not to think about.
I just try to avoid giving money to the living bad ones
I was pretty ok until MJ.
Yes, because I don't care for the individual.
Yes. It's fine.
Alright which one of you is still listening to Lostprophets?
Yeah there's definitely a line there for me.
I don't care if they are an asshole. They're just people at the end of the day.
But I can't listen to lost prophets or Gary glitter.
Same. I listen to a few bands that have had a member accused of sexual assault and of emotional abuse.
But Lostprophets are beyond tainted because Watkins is one of the most deranged convicted paedos in British legal history. It's impossible for me to separate his music from his utterly sick crimes. Gary Glitter is up there too.
This is the first band that came to mind when I saw this thread. Even though I liked their music when it came out, I would feel gross listening to it now.
No. I also learned to not be a fan of anyone. I dislike people in general.
I think it depends on the person, what they've done, if they've been convicted and individual tolerance.
Many people shrug when they learn that John Lennon was an abusive asshole who used to beat his wife. Many more wilfully let Chris Brown back into the industry after how badly he beat the shit out of Rihanna. Even artists like Michael Jackson and R Kelly managed to avoid child molestation accusations for years, and likewise more people rushed to cancel 6ix9ine for snitching on the Nine Trey Gangsters than they did when he was convicted of doing inappropriate sexual things to a 13 year old girl and somehow only landing probation.
Then you have truly bad cases like Ian Watkins, former leader singer of LostProphets. The band had effectively been disavowed from the moment of his arrest.