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Reddit @lemmy.world

AES @lemmy.ronsmans.eu

2年前

Lemmy vs Reddit in a nutshell

Lemmy: "that is a fair point"

Reddit: "you fucking moron"

248 评论

platform bias is real, folks. i’ve had lots of the lemmy F’s since i’ve been here.
- That is a fair point.
  
  You fucking moron!
- F
  
  Well look, here’s a Lemmy F right here! F!

As a Reddit user who's recently moved to Lemmy - that's a fair point, you fucking moron
- Now that's just Australia.
  
  As a Australian, I can conferm

That's quite a fair point.
I think the reason behind that is that it's a new place and people are shy in new environments. Not only they behave more cautious but they lurk more (which leads to more lurking by others).
Did you get that you fucking moron?
- Are you fucking sorry??
  
  No, this is Patrick.
- Yes, I'm a bit of a moron, but I still want to be fair. In every single community I read the same comment on and on again. It goes something like this:
  People in name_of_community are x.
  With its obvious variation
  name_of_community is y.
  That always sounds to me both strange and nonsensical. Every large set of beings is, obviously, large. We're always sampling it from a very biased perspective. You may be unlucky in your interactions; or perhaps you're more tactful; or you've connected in a very bad day; etc., etc., etc.. So saying that name_of_community is y is just a Quixotian attack on a windmill.
  If that gets you high, elated, if it makes you feel better about yourself because you're not like them, please go ahead and keep enjoying yourself. But also remember you're riding an beaten old horse, wearing a rusty armor, and talking nonsense.
  
  Those giants won't slay themselves.
  "Charge, Rocinante!"
- Lurk moar

I hope Lemmy moves past this phase of directly measuring itself in every way, real and imagined, against Reddit. Doesn't seem like a healthy way to start the community. We need our own identity if we ever hope for this to take hold.
- That is a fair point.
  
  You fucking moron
  
  Accctttualy I work in the points job sector and technicalllly it is more of a "fine" point.
- I think getting rid of the karma system would make a world of difference. Keep votes visible on comments and posts but no total tally. All it does is bring tons of bots to farm it, and the kind of people who obsess over fake internet points... Which are always miserable assholes that we don't need. I've really been enjoying how laid back every has been on here in the few days I've been here. I still have no clue how a decent portion of it works but I like figuring it out and seeing everyone actually being pleasnt in the comments.
- This.
  I guess its just natural to make comparisons between two similar products, but its something I'm sure will settle down over the coming months. I just hope that the community remains how it is and doesn't become toxic in the way Reddir became after gaining the popularity.

I'm wondering if it's the lurkers. Based on personal experience: I enjoyed Reddit from the sidelines for years--never made an account. Switch to Lemmy and few users means no conversation, so I figured I'd jump in. But it turns out I'm a pretty boring, literal, mild-mannered commenter. Nice, but no zing. I'm still kind of waiting for the banter.
- no zing doesn't get the upvotes though!
  And that's exactly what i want. So over the recycled, rehashed, reposted, or whatever that has become of almost every subreddit.
  can we go back to sharing information and solutions and it being at least kind of fun
  
  A lot of the comments/ jokes were just recycled forced humour karma whoring, because people knew they’d get top content and a quadrillion upvotes for writing the same old shit over and over again
  
  This.
  (I'm sorry)
- I feel this. It felt like anything I ever had to comment had been said a dozen times by the time I stumbled into a thread, so I rarely felt any need or desire to post on Reddit. Here, I almost feel obligated to, just to keep the threads going. Part of me is excited to see the activity keep picking up here, but part of me is enjoying actually feeling like my boring-ass comments are worth posting, and also knowing said lame comments aren't going to get heaped with random snark. Feels like the medium size forums I used to frequent back in the 00s and early 10s.
- Good lord I can't imagine having had browsed reddit without an account. The default subs were always so awful/toxic. It was nice having a curated list of hobby subs and cat pics and such
  
  That's how my husband did it, but he misses so much I don't know if it's culture but awareness? Eavesdropping? People watching? It was a lot of scrolling, but also a lot of things I wouldn't have heard of any other way
- You're not allowed to be mild mannered you idiot. Them's the rules. Now engage me in ill intentioned banter. We will meet at dawn.

I am absolutely trying my best to be friendly, tolerant and open minded here on Lemmy to set the tone for a growing culture here
- I don't 100% agree with this posts point. If you said the Reddit comment in many of the subs you'd have the comment deleted for personal attacks. However, I do agree partially with the Lemmy one.
  I'm finding myself more willing to engage with differing views while robustly defending my own views and I'll pepper my arguments with some swearing when appropriate.
  It's a closer representation of my actual self. I'm a sweary, Northern Englishman irl but I'm fair and give peope a chance and will listen. So that's how I behave here now.
  On Reddit I talked more like a polite AI bot with no opinion on anything lest I receive a suspension or get my comment deleted by an overzealous AutoModerator bot for "personal attack".
  
  I wish that type of in-person language use was more acceptable throughout the US... I'm from Jersey and while I can speak freely in that region and be received normally, everyone here in the Midwest is afraid of me and thinks I'm angry when I speak freely...
- You twat...
  Jk don't shoot me
  
  I don't think he could hear you with that bell end in your mouth, mate..
- I avoid the debate because I don't feel informed enough to have a valid opinion.
  However, it does concern me that in all the tussle over trans rights there are children in the middle being used as political footballs and many will be comitting suicide and hurting themselves because of what adults are saying in the halls of power across the world and in the newspapers.
  I also feel some empathy because of a recent guidance change in the UK that is very similar to the Section 28 Law of the 90s that made my life as a gay teen very, very miserable.
  
  Dwight you ignorant slut
  
  I think a community that welcomes bigots is unwelcoming to everyone else, and that tolerance is not a virtue that should be applied to all universally, but rather a quality that should be shared only with those that practice it themselves.
  Bigotry should not be tolerated.

Everyone in this thread are fucking morons.
- I'm not, I'm just here to promote "Barbie".
  
  Can we just get back to ~~Rampart~~ beans please?
  
  Glad our country didn't ban your film
  
  Esteemed Academy Award nominated character actress Margot Robbie! (Sometimes I get mistaken for you.) Is it true each meal you got on the set of Barbie was served in 600 tiny Barbie-sized toy plates?
- You make a fair point.
- That's a fair point. But I'm not. :)
  
  It's just "manager"
- I mean you're not wrong
- Moron, reporting for duty!
- You called
- you fucking moron /s

That hasn't been my experience.
It's still a very mixed reaction if you say something contrary to the dominant opinion.
And still just as likely to get strawmanned if you disagree with an aspect, but still overall agree with the conclusion.
- i love how this is getting downvoted lol
  the irony
  
  It's not as of right now, but I wouldn't say downvotes are the issue. The reality is that downvote = disagree no matter what rule you create that says it doesn't.
  What I'm talking about are the insults, mischaracterizations, and general non productive discussion on comments that others don't agree with.

So far my experience on Lemmy.world is more hostile than I was expecting. Very quick to downvote and troll here. Hoping I've only just had the misfortune of finding a lot of bad eggs quickly??????
- @TPetrichor@lemmy.world
  What community are you subscribed to?
  Generally, my experience was welcoming with long posts and orderly discussion.
  
  Games is what I seem to be getting all the downvotes in. And some silly comment replies in an Apple thread for being a non Apple fan 😅
- Depends on your own attitude too. If you are nice, you get treated nice. That's my experience anyway. Maybe not in some communities like politics, I don't follow those...
  
  Feel free to creep on my comments, I feel like I'm pretty amicable 🥺
- Lemmy.world got big fast. Almost everything I see from Lemmy.world isn't particularly good because of this. It seems to have a lot of low effort content and more hostility. It's the instance that the laziest group of migrants joined, and it shows. A lot of people didn't look past the instance with the highest user count. No offense to anyone who joined it, this might not be you just some of the people there are this.
  
  Is there a better 'lemmy' instance you'd recommend?
- Imo I'd say lemmy.world is most Reddit-like of all the Lemmy servers. Though there are always a handful to deal with on any server. Report to admins if you witness toxic, aggressive kind of behaviour.
  If you are willing to keep your mind open a bit and listen as much as speak, beehaw.org might be your pace.
  
  From the rules beehaw seems much more willing to censor unfortunately

Now we just have to keep this culture of respect, even if the platform gains popularity. Buckle up!

Trust me the extreme Redditors are here now too.
- "Extreme" redditors lmao
  
  When the X-Games were new, drinking Mountain Dew was considered EXTREME, ok?
  
  I assume they mean the loud, angry assholes.
- They are flocking to all alternatives, kind of funny Reddit is exactly molded for them and still they want to come to other alternatives.
  
  Those kind of extreme personalities often thrive on shouting people down though, which you can't do in an echo chamber filled with only shouty people, so they follow the ones they consider to be sheep

I've encountered some rude people on Lemmy, but also a lot of people who love genuine discussion, helping others and want the best for the platform and communities.
- There are, statistically, still idiots here too.
  
  What if I'm just a sarcastic idiot?
- I can be rude, but also love genuine discussion. I just don't believe in limiting cuss words on a public anonymous forum like this.
  Nobody should give a fuck about shit and fuck when racism and bigotry are more impactful.
  
  Totally, I was meaning more impolite, hostile or confrontational etc than saying fuck!

that is a fair point
- you fucking moron
  
  This got a genuine laugh out of me, good one guys!

I am currently in the middle of a lengthy political argument with someone on c/politics, and we fundamentally disagree on things, but both of us are being cordial about it and I appreciate that.
- I just came from politics and basically it has devolved into name calling and piss poor hypocrisy, salted with thinly veiled death threats. Feels like home
  
  Reddit just became blocking, banning and censorship. I don't care if somebody disagrees with me, the muting of dissent or debate or discourse or whatever was really sinister to me. People have different opinions, we shouldn't be so quick to deny them freedom of speech.
- It's how old-Reddit used to be. People didn't over-use the downvote button to disagree. They went to the effort of commenting back to give counterpoints. Redditors became lazy and instead moved to posting unfunny puns and getting trigger happy with votes.
  With it discussion died or it became an echo-chamber.
  Even in subs where my politics aligned it became dull-as-ditchwater discussing anything because you'd just get people more extreme in an ideology considering themselves 'right' because they had more upvotes.
  
  I can't quite figure out the purpose of the votes here and I think I just prefer to comment instead of giving an up/down.
  I think the up/down thing also promotes shorter comments, at least it did for me, since I know it can be hard to totally agree with someone who is making several points so I tried to keep it short and to the point. Which is dumb, because difficult topics are complex and deserve more words thrown at them not less.
  Maybe the utility of the votes for me is when I don't know what I want to say in a reply, but I want to express something. Then I vote.
- I got a bit heated there about something yesterday because I had irl stresses going on, and when I calmed down I went and edited my comment to make nicer and apologize for rudeness.
  To my surprise, the comment is clearly still upvoted, and the guy I was talking with told me not to sweat it. A few times now I've posted a controversial opinion and observed it, and always, it's at mildly upvoted.
  Honestly this makes me wonder how much of the downvotes were from bots or paid shills.
- Yeah I managed to find that Reddit dude when arguing with someone. Either that or I was the Reddit dude ... Damn ....

- Idk, I think it's interesting to see the general public 'grading' opinions and information.
  It definitely plays a huge role in the echo-chamber effect, but it's not like lemmy is diverting from that utility.

The fediverse is far more open to the idea of being a "marketplace of ideas" .
That is what Reddit was before Spez got greedy and abandoned the liberal ideas that made Reddit great when Aaron Swartz was around.
- The world would be a much better place with Aaron Swartz and more people like him. He was such a good dude.
  
  He was too good for this planet.
  
  I would bet Aaron would have contributed to an alternative too knowing how Spez and Knothing are.

TBH I've seen (and engaged in) plenty of the latter on Lemmy too. The only place where I've seen such behavior actually banned was themotte
- I'm sorry but I have to ask or it'll bother me for the rest of my life: is it "the motte" (the moth in German), or "them otte", like otter missing an r?
  
  "The motte" as in "motte-and-bailey"
  
  The obvious answer here is of course: yes

At least the circlejerking was brought here intact...

Aren't a ton of Lemmy users from Reddit? That being said, I've had more positive interactions here than on Reddit, but I haven't been on Lemmy that long.
- The subset of users that switched to Lemmy is smart enough to get over the "select an instance"-hurdle and fine with being on a smaller website with less content. This results in a different kind of interaction. Poeple here seem to still remember that there are actually living people behind those usernames. If Lemmy keeps growing there will be more chances to have the proper "go fuck yourself"-kind of interaction we are used to.
  
  Since Lemmy isn't for profit I think that'll delay features that cater to the lowest common denominator, thus extending our current period of quality discussions.
  
  I joined lemmy to tell someone to stick something in their butt, so I think you are being somewhat optimistic.
  
  I've already had a couple xd
- More and more shills (and people polarized by shills) will work their way in. Personally I believe we're in a honeymoon phase.
- To be honest i think it is just number and bell curve. A smaller user base will have less extreme, and strangely more opinions as no critical mass for a general trend to be form. Just my guess and source is trust me bro.
  
  source is trust me bro
  Verified. Source: we got this

Lets test this…
Abortion should be illegal because that would help population grow faster, leading to more cheap labor that would benefit everyone. It should also be illegal to be gay, because gay people cannot have children and all major companies need more workers. Gay people are also not as fun to joke with during lunch. Therefore having gay people in your company will decrease the productivity of your workers.
What steps did you take today to prevent the spread of gay and abortions?
- that is a fair point you fucking moron
- Nice bait
- Well, if a proportion of people are born gay, then more abortions will mathematically lead to fewer gays, so being anti-abortion is being pro-gay.
- What steps did you take today to prevent the spread of gay and abortions?
  By blocking you.
  
  You have the spine of a gummy bear.
- I ate a frog.
- If you really want to test it, then you've got to post an opinion that disagrees with both of the two main dominant opinions and is a bit more complex rather than just staunchly for/against something.
  So say that you're against abortion, except advocate strongly for it in the event of rape or mental disabilities. And say that you're not against gay people, but against same sex marriage and gay people should just be celibate their whole lives.
  And if you really want to ruffle some feather, say that you don't think pedophiles should be put in jail. Only child molesters/rapists should be jailed.

I can't not agree with this.
- Ok, that is a fair point.
  
  You fucking moron

Literally just re-uninstalled Reddit because some neanderthal (probably an insult to neanderthals) couldn't even argue properly without putting words in my mouth I never said or implied
- Some will make their way here, there are alot of tankies on lemmy.ml and lemmygrad.ml who somehow love Russia and China
  
  We can speak the same of extreme American leftist.
  
  I'm neither American, European, Russian, nor Chinese, and have no clear vested interest in any if them. Seeing how Americans view China as the "big evil" from the outside is just mind-boggling. Most of the bad stuff you think China did, they didn't. Some of the terrible stuff they did, the US did as well. They do have a bad side that the US doesn't have, but the US does some things worse than China.
  Now its easy for the naive to just reply "whataboutism" to my comment and move on. But what I'm trying to say is that the world isn't black and white. The US isn't the "good guys", no one is. Take a look at some communities on Lemmygrad. You might change some of your views.
- Oh, believe me, that happens here, too, and it happens in the exact same places it happened most on Reddit (communities dedicated to politics and specific pieces of software).
  For instance, the community surrounding ReVanced here seems to be just as toxic as it was on Reddit.
  
  Yeah, that culture is coming from the top, nothing much to do about that one sadly
  
  I mean, it is the same people after all

I'm sure we're going to see all sorts of behaviour here soon if we aren't already. The Reddit attitude I hope we avoid as much as possible is that pointlessly aggressive tone though. Not just in arguments but responses to posts from people who seem to have only just learnt the word fuck and use it to add an extra condescending slant to their weirdly celebrated rant about how someone misread a paper or something.
- It seems like I've noticed a little more of that redditbaggery the last 2 days. Could be that I've just been on here more though.
  
  What I've hated about arguing in reddit was that they would attack things that are not relevant to the discussion at hand, like grammar, past post of the user that's not even remotely related to the discussion.
  Also they get needlessly attached to phrases and words on people's replies taking away the context and attaching their own ideas to that. That kind of style of argument is very detrimental to civilized discourse and super exhausting to engage in.

Just wait. The only reason why Lemmy is more polite is because it's smaller. I think that attitude comes with the territory, unfortunately. If you want to have a less toxic community, the first thing you need to do is get rid of the downvote button. Downvotes are inherently toxic. Lemmy is actually worse than reddit in this regard, because you can actually see the ratio of upvotes to downvotes. So, even if your comment has a high score, you can still feel shitty knowing that X number of people downvoted it.
- This guy downvotes :p
- I've run into a few nasty trolls. The difference is they're banned in short order.
- Also, Reddit votes are fuzzed, and I think maybe delayed. It's very echochambery because I never see people with a close number of upvotes and downvotes- it's always one person in a discussion 90+% upvoted and another person(me) 90+% downvoted

With that short lived bit of nostalgia for cringy old meme formats I think it's also safe to say that this platform skews old.
- If by "old" you mean not using idiotic words like "unalive", putting trigger warnings before the word "shit" and claiming to have DID, ADHD, OCD and Autism all unprompted - then I can live with it skewing "old".
  
  spoken like a true geezer
  fwiw "unalive" came about to circumvent automatic censorship, It's the young people being tech savvy. Meanwhile, you're over in the corner stewing as the world passes you by.
  Don't fall into the perpetual trap of thinking the current crop of young people are the worst thing ever, it'll make your hair fall out
  
  No that's not what he meant, you just made it up to feel important, much like how young people sometimes fake illnesses to feel special.
  
  Unalive is the stupidest word I've heard. I've seen one YouTube video (about true crime) using this word, and I was thinking to myself: does this word mean what I think it does? And apparently it does. I looked at the comments, hoping that someone would point this out (that this word is stupid) apparently no one was saying anything about it and I feel like that I'm the stupid one....

Personally I liked many of the opposite views and some conflict. Made for entertaining discussions at times even if I don't agree with it.
When everyone has the same opinion, not much left to discuss.

I commented on this when encountering the 2nd type of person on here. As it gains popularity you'll encounter more of them, it's inevitable.
- A few weeks ago it was great here. Interactions were mostly positive. But now I am beginning to see the same thing that happened to Reddit happen to Lemmy: people are bringing their color politics into every conversation. Like, a comment can be just a comment, upvoting or downvoting it doesn't mean that you're supporting/betraying Republicans or Democrats.
  
  Don't you know that's just [insert political/social/idealogical bad group] rhetoric? Of course they'd want us all to just ignore the intense politics present in boring bog standard opinions and prentend like people can converse without making grand political statements! [Boogeyman of the week] wants us docile and disengaged from the complete everpresent idealogical war which only a select few can perceive! I have to connect this to every facet of my life to satisfy my obsession or then my therapist might be right that I'm delusional!

you fucking a fair point

I used to cringe every time I saw an orangered, like aw shit who'd I piss off now? lol

Why not "you fucking donkey"?

248 评论