Breaking: Trump Verdict Livethread
Breaking: Trump Verdict Livethread
Jury HAS reached a verdict. 11 hours, 43 minutes.
Developing.
Analysis is saying the jury using the word "verdict" indicates this is not a hung jury.
Jury has asked for more time to fill out paperwork, which makes sense, 34 counts x 12 jurors, 408 line items?
Judge has now called for the jury.
Detail on each count here, 3 basic categories:
https://www.npr.org/2024/05/30/g-s1-1848/trump-hush-money-trial-34-counts
Trump was charged with falsifying business records in the first degree.
Invoices for legal services
Guilty on 11 of 11 charges
Checks paid for legal services
Guilty on 11 of 11 charges
Ledger entries for legal expenses
Guilty on 12 of 12 charges
No bail, sentencing on July 11th, 4 days before the Republican convention.
Defense has until 6/13 to file motions, prosecution has until 6/27 to respond.
Trump is responding predictably. Attacking the judge and the whole process.
Jury HAS reached a verdict. 11 hours, 43 minutes.
Developing.
Analysis is saying the jury using the word "verdict" indicates this is not a hung jury.
Jury has asked for more time to fill out paperwork, which makes sense, 34 counts x 12 jurors, 408 line items?
Judge has now called for the jury.
Detail on each count here, 3 basic categories:
https://www.npr.org/2024/05/30/g-s1-1848/trump-hush-money-trial-34-counts
Trump was charged with falsifying business records in the first degree.
Invoices for legal services
Guilty on 11 of 11 charges
Checks paid for legal services
Guilty on 11 of 11 charges
Ledger entries for legal expenses
Guilty on 12 of 12 charges
No bail, sentencing on July 11th, 4 days before the Republican convention.
Defense has until 6/13 to file motions, prosecution has until 6/27 to respond.
Trump is responding predictably. Attacking the judge and the whole process.
If you're trying to keep track of where we're at in the Trump prosecutions:
Updated 05/30/2024
New York
34 state felonies
Stormy Daniels Payoff
Investigation
Indictment
Arrest
Trial
Conviction <- You Are Here Guilty, all 34 counts.
Sentencing - July 11, 2024
Washington, D.C.
4 federal felonies
January 6th Election Interference
Investigation
Indictment
Arrest <- You Are Here
Trial - The trial, originally scheduled for March 4th, has been placed on hold pending the Supreme Court ruling on Presidential Immunity. They are due to hear those arguments on April 25th.
Conviction
Sentencing
Florida
40 federal felonies
Top Secret Documents charges
Investigation
Indictment
Original indictment was for 37 felonies.
3 new felonies were added on July 27, 2023.
Arrest <- You Are Here
Trial - Postponed Indefinitely
Conviction
Sentencing
Georgia
10 state felonies
Election Interference
As of 3/13/24 - Judge McAfee cleared 6 charges, 3 against Trump, saying they were too generic to be enforced.
As of 3/15/24 - The case may proceed, but either Fulton County DA, Fani Willis and her office or Special Prosecutor Nathan Wade must remove themselves due to the appearance of impropriety.
Investigation
Indictment
Arrest <- You Are Here
All 19 defendants have surrendered.
Trial - A trial date of Aug. 5, 2024 has been requested, not approved yet.
Three defendants, Kenneth Chesebro, Sidney Powell, and bail bondsman Scott Hall, have all pled guilty and have agreed to testify in other cases.
Conviction
Sentencing
Other grand juries, such as for the documents at Bedminster, or the Arizona fake electors, have not been announced.
The E. Jean Carroll trial for sexual assault and defamation where Trump was found liable and ordered to pay $5 million before immediately defaming her again resulting in a demand for $10 million is not listed as it's a civil case and not a crimimal one. He was found liable in that case for $83.3 million.
There had been multiple cases in multiple states to remove Trump from the ballot, citing ineligibility under the 14th amendment.
The Supreme Court ruled on March 4th that states do not have the ability to determine eligibility in Federal elections.
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Man... As the verdicts rolled in, I could genuinely feel my stress fading. This fucker has finally, finally been forced to experience a negative repercussion for his actions, and I can't wait to see him experience more.
No he hasn’t.
He wasn’t even remanded to custody.
He hasn’t been sentenced.
If the sentences are punitive monetary fines, then his “consequences” are nothing more than he’s ever had to deal with. He’ll just keep doing what he’s always been doing and raid the Republican money chest to pay his expenses.
I know somebody has to come out to play devil's advocate at every turn. Yes the sentence could be a nothingburger. Yes he will appeal no matter what.
At the very least, I can now call him convicted felon Trump. Justice has prevailed at least in this part.
This was also the weakest case against him. Once he loses in November I can't wait to watch him deal with this shit 3 more times. He's either going to die in a courtroom or a jail cell.
Kinda hoping for courtroom so we get a sketch artist's rendering of it
It was not the weakest case. It was actually one of the strongest, with tons of corroborating evidence.
If anything, I think the weakest case right now is the insurrection one. Fulton county is the next strongest, then the hush money case just finished, then the classified docs case.
It's a bit nitpicky though. He's super obviously guilty in all of them just based on publicly available info. Maybe the defense in each case has a bullet proof strategy we don't know about but... I doubt it.
Okay, how is Insurrection Day the weakest case? He literally went on to live TV to command his "proud boys" troops to "stand down".
It wouldn't be hard to take that and present it as Trump was just trying to stop it.
By weakest, we are talking about which one has the best chance of beating a guilty verdict. Trump did a bunch of fucked up shit on Jan 6 and in the weeks beforehand but I think a good lawyer could at least get him a hung jury. At least with the publicly available evidence right now.
The problem for Trump is that, like in New York, he will want to interfere in his defense and end up making things way worse for himself.
If it were any of us, being a convicted felon would have meaning and consequences.
I don’t think I’m being a devil’s advocate, I’m not arguing an unpopular position, just pessimistic and likely pragmatic.
I'm hopeful that today might be a turning point. It's a significant occurrence.
In a year's time Trump will either be dead, in jail, or in the whitehouse. Of those three I honestly think jail is the most likely.
While this specific trial might not land him in jail directly, it will significantly errode, consume, or expend his support. The idiots that keep sending him money don't have infinite money. The title "Convicted Felon Donald Trump" will have meaning to many swing voters. Todays outcome provides a good excuse for republicans to decline support.
Today is a significant impediment to getting to the white house, and if he doesn't do that he will go to jail.
In summary, a year from now when he's in jail and we're looking back at the journey, today will be the turning point - the start of a series of bad news.
Not to be too negative Nancy, but don’t forget he has a whole radical base that are looking for an excuse to do violent things. Any real consequences for trump could be acted upon by those insurrectionists. They’re already attacking infrastructure. Here’s a West Point article about it.
You're right of course. I was just listening to some commentary about how poorly biden is doing in the polls.
I just want to be positive I guess. It's been a long time between drinks.
On that note, everyone in the US should be preparing to live through a civil war. Hopefully it won't go that far, but realistically it all depends on who supports it and how willing they are to risk their future on that gambit. I wouldn't be surprised to see either an insurrection fizzle out quickly or one gain fast momentum and become asymmetric warfare at first, followed by the real hardware getting used as parts of the military split into factions.
Yes. But other than oil & banking executives, who would do illegal stuff in a heartbeat if they could make money and get away with it, and crazies like Musk and the MyPillow guy, how many business-minded people would want someone convicted business fraud to lead a good economic environment for business?
Those same business leaders likely vote republican in order to more easily get tax breaks and favorable laws, so apparently a lot of businesses want that kind of leadership - even if it wasn’t specifically what you meant.
He will never see a real punishment so let's hope for practical benefits like losing votes from low-information idiots and draining Repub coffers.
July is gonna be interesting when all you doubters walk back your claims. The judge is hyper aware of the contempt x10, the fact Cohen did time in prison for the other side of this thing, the attacks on the judge’s daughter and family, staff, intimidation of jurors and witnesses…
Don't take it from me https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0fYRCjdMsE&t=146s
July is gonna be interesting when all you doubters walk back your claims.
Do you not recognize how eager we all are for that to be true? Please, show up in July and blow a raspberry at me because I was wrong to believe Trump will die of old age, having never seen the inside of a jail cell, living a 1% lifestyle. I would love nothing more.