john89 @ john89 @lemmy.ca

Posts

95

Comments

1,275

Joined

1 yr. ago

Moderating

---

🥱

Yeah, no. You might want to look into a 'crab mentality' and see how much you and your peers exhibit it.

Gonna block you now.

Keep doing whatever you can to avoid holding women accountable for anything.

That's how we treat them like children.

I can tell you're upset because I'm saying things you don't like. It's okay, I see it all the time and don't expect more from you people on these forums.

Goodbye. Easy block.

Don't care how I "come across."

It's part of being able to think for myself.

I fully-expect people like you to react the way you are whenever you see it; that's how bad it's gotten.

🥱

Genuinely feels like feminists come here just to argue with men, lol.

Goodbye.

🥱

Easy block.

It's a cultural problem and it requires cultural solutions.

We need to value different things, and that's purposefully vague because it applies to so many aspects of our lives.

I've recently been thinking of it as a 'war on modesty,' which is what we need to see value in in order to fight back against consumerism.

Do more with less. Appreciate what we have. Those kinds of things.

It's unfortunate that these basic suggestions could solve such major problems, but I believe that's how far we've strayed from the truth.

Patriarchy and capitalism go hand in hand. We are still saying the same thing.

They are related, but not the same. We are not saying the same thing.

You do not know what those words mean.

Ironic, considering you seem to literally believe capitalism and patriarchy mean the same thing.

You take it as patronizing because it would be silly for you to not know what that word means.

I take it as patronizing because it is and I've dealt with your kind before.

I am going to have to block you now, though, without reading the rest of your drivel.

Re-read my previous comments if you have any further misunderstandings or still believe we are in agreement. We are not and you are being willfully ignorant if you think otherwise.

You may have the last word. I can tell you're dying for it.

Yeah, just re-read my previous comment.

I didn't expect more from you, to be honest.

Yes, exactly.

Although I will agree with you that there are women out there that feel as though they are 'owed' something due to the historical treatment of women.

Not really. I'm referring to women enjoying the benefits they get from having others do the work for them.

Trying to argue that they can't enjoy this without some overarching control is just reinforcing the idea that women can't think for themselves.

Good job doing your part to reinforce the idea that women should be treated like children.

as you talk about how women are so baby brained that they can’t think.

Saying it's an 'anti-feminist' talking point holds no water when we're describing reality. You're literally supporting my argument by saying that women can't rise above the expectations the patriarchy has put on them. They can't think for themselves.

You're also supporting my notion that you refuse to acknowledge greed and consumerism as being the root cause of these issues because you're so distracted and invested in blaming "the patriarchy."

It's a lot easier for women to blame "the patriarchy," because if they addressed their own greed then they would have to give something up. If all the blame is put on "the patriarchy," then women can continue to consume just as they always have and delude themselves into thinking they're not part of the problem.

It’s just the women’s side of patriarchy.

Now this is an interesting point to bring up, although it does reinforce my argument. Men are more likely to value autonomy, women are more likely to value homogeny. It's why I said that women have a harder time thinking for themselves than men and why they've been conditioned to operate as one unit.

None of this is up for debate and you haven't disproved any of my points. Even if these ideas aren't acceptable in our social circles, it doesn't mean they don't describe reality.

Stop trying to look good in front of your peers.

That’s not what I am saying. Women and men can rise above those expectations. It’s called feminism.

No, it's not. It's called autonomy.

“men good, women bad”

Wrong. I never said nor implied anything like this.

You described an aspect of patriarchy as it effects both women’s expectations of men and men’s expectations of women.

It's an aspect of the patriarchy, but it stems from consumerism and greed.

you use terms that accurately describe the ideologies at work rather than the group itself.

Wrong. I'm telling you uncomfortable truths so you have to plug your ears and deny.

Because to do so builds stereotypes

No. Seeing their actions builds the stereotype. If they can't rise above other people's expectations, then it coincidentally reinforces the idea that they can't think for themselves.

In your case, you are stuck in the male patriarchal false consciousness that is clouding your ability to see that we are saying the same thing.

In your case, you're desperate to prove that "feminism is the solution and the patriarchy is the problem" when the real issue is greed and consumerism.

We can just agree to disagree here. If you're going to be pretentious and patronizing by saying "I agree but I don't understand the words being used," then just re-read this comment.

complete free will

Hyperbole.

It's a spectrum, for sure. I wouldn't be who I am without the influence of others.

That said, women are way more likely to go along with what the crowd (their peers) is doing than I am. If they disagree with the crowd, they are way less likely to put those disagreements into action than I am.

They cannot think for themselves and it's encouraged by those who refuse to acknowledge it. It's not a problem unique to women, but they suffer from it more than men because women have been conditioned to operate as one unit.

It is disagreeing, though. You're saying that women can't rise above the expectations put on them by "the patriarchy." I agree that women, on average, cannot think for themselves.

It's not the fault of the patriarchy that women like expensive things and are willing to reward males who buy them things with sex. Women themselves encourage this behavior.

Trying to absolve them of any responsibility is just contributing to the culture of treating women like children.

You are right, but that is due to patriarchy creating the cultural expectations

This is where we disagree, and it's not just the words that we use. Women are greedy, too. They like the nice things men buy them. They don't care about the true cost of consumerism because they've been conditioned to ignore it.

It is women simply trying to meet their side of the expectation.

This is why I agree with you insomuch as women aren't able to think for themselves. I don't put that expectation on them. People richer than us do. Even though I'm able to rise above their influence, the average person cannot. This goes doubly-so for women because women have been encouraged for generations to function as one entity as much as possible.

It's not their fault insomuch as they can't think for themselves, I'll agree with you there.

But the agreement stops when you blame the patriarchy over consumerism. No, this generation has been convinced to sell itself out to the lowest bidder. Average women are proud consumers that want to live like instagram models. Any kind of modesty is shunned in their social circles. It's drowned out by "look at this new thing I bought! Please praise me for spending money!"

The sex speaks for itself. Men have a ridiculously easy time getting laid if they have money, even if they're pieces of shit in every other way.

Unfortunately, the homogenization of women works against them when they're all conditioned to be proud consumers living vicariously through those richer than them.

Found the stockholm syndrome victim.