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Why all the bad reviews for Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny? (spoilers)

There's one common criticism I agree with: de-aging Harrison Ford is not that convincing. In particular, he still sounds 80 years old, and they had to use CGI for some of his movements. 30 years after Jurassic Park, they still can't animate a person jumping correctly.

Most of the rest of the criticisms don't make any sense to me.

  1. The set pieces were memorable: I've read several reviews that complained they couldn't remember anything that happened after the movie was over, but DoD starts off with a thriller, and there are many more scenes that would be heart stopping if Indy didn't have the best plot armor in the business. The last sequence was an absolute jaw dropper and a total surprise.

  2. Phoebe Waller-Bridge was good I've read a lot of complaints about her acting in this movie, some reviewers wrote that she ruined the movie for them. I think maybe they disliked her Helena character because she's a scumbag who gets the upper hand over Indy several times?

  3. Dial of Destiny has very little fan service. Karen Allen and John Rhys-Davies make appearances, but they are short, muted, tasteful, and they work. There's a picture of Sean Connery seen in passing.

But DoD is more interested in what it means for a fantasy character like Indiana Jones to grow old. It has something to say about that and spends very little time remembering the cool bits of past movies.

The Indy of DoD has become more bitter and more humane in his age.

Indy no longer has the passion of the academic fighting the mercenary archaeologist in Raiders. He's resigned to ubiquity of the Helena's of the world, but he's still determined that he'll win and she'll lose. The theme of disdain for anyone who would work with villains to get what they want is strong in DoD.

Indy still hates Nazis for being an evil empire that would use powerful artifacts to conquer the world, but in DoD he also hates Nazis for being racist, murderous, thieving tyrants who like to start wars. He's still a son-of-a-bitch, but not as much the selfish, driven son-of-a-bitch he used to be.

The movie connects ( without any preaching ) the Nazi hunt for artifacts with their mass looting of their victims, and connects U.S. support of some Nazis post-war with the moral degradation of Helena and any other archaeologist who would work with them.

  1. It's a good Indy Movie DoD has one of the spookiest tomb robberies of the series, cool artifiacts, a sense of deep time intruding upon the present, insane car chases, world travel to cool places, and its fun. The only thing its missing is maybe the raw sex appeal of a young Harrison Ford? I don't know.

  2. It's not supposed to be realistic 'nough said.

6 The ending is good I do understand folks who didn't like the ending because it was confusing and went by too fast, because most of the people I saw the movie with didn't get it. The ending was subtle and happens quickly. Here's an explanation:

The dial was designed by Archimedes to bring somebody back to Syracuse on the day the Romans invaded. It can't lead you anywhere or anywhen else.

His hope was that someone near his own time who actually cared about Syracuse could use it to bring help to save the city.

When he found that Indiana Jones was the first (and apparently only) person to use it, and he was from 2000 years in the future, Archimedes knew his plan had failed. Indy wanted to stay, but Helena didn't want to change the past any more than they already had. She also wanted him to live, so she dragged him away.

I think DoD could have explained this a bit better. There are some glaring plot holes, but for me, at least, they were fridge moments.

Indy getting a glimpse of the ancient world, but being dragged back by various forces, is a constant in every movie.

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14 comments

  • I watched it last Thursday and didn't realize it was the last movie in the series. I haven't icky seen a couple other IJ films and rarely see movies in theaters, last was before covid.

    I really enjoyed it and thought it was well done. The pacing was perfect, I fully understood the plot and at no point was I confused. There was clearly a lot of call backs and references I didn't get, but I was impressed. Plus seeing Ford shirtless was hot af

  • Good analysis!

    I saw it and thought it was shockingly good overall. Not better than Raiders or Last Crusade, but really well done in and of itself and certainly better than Crystal Skull (and probably Temple of Doom).

    Not sure why it’s getting the level of hate that it is.

  • My wife and I saw it this afternoon. Overall we enjoyed it for what it was - another episode of an action movie series. About our only criticism is that we both felt the Nazi bad guys trope has worn out it’s welcome…. True, Indy lives in that era, but do they have to be the bad guys virtually every time? Temple of Doom was kind of nice that it had a completely different villain.

  • For me, scene by scene, it just felt like a copy/paste of earlier films. "Oh, this is just like that part from Raiders where Marian got kidnapped..." or "OK, this is clearly an analog for when Indy strapped himself to the submarine..." or "LOL it's a miniature rope bridge from Temple of Doom!" and "Yup, here come the bugs and spiders, just like before!"

    I kept waiting for something new, and what I got was "Well damn it, where DOESN'T it hurt??!?!" (best scene in the movie though)

    I guess there are worse ways to end the franchise, but it just didn't feel like Mangold brought anything new to it.

  • I saw it last week and enjoyed it. Perhaps my third favourite IJ film.

  • Easy/fashionable to hate sequels, cgi remakes doubly so, throw in deaging a grumpy actor and you have the trifecta.

    Haven't watched it yet, briefly skimmed the last one, it's so, so easy to misstep and the stakes are in a way some people's childhoods (which is silly, but still).

    Had low expectations, didn't think waller-bridge would be the problem so much as fan-service but a review I saw that was harsh actually made me want to watch it (on home theater obviously, I'm not going to a real cinema for it).

  • My complaints with the film: Action scenes were uninteresting. Maybe it was the VFX, or maybe it was the fact that Harrison Ford is 80 years old, but I felt like the action scenes were too long even through not much really happens in them.

    • Opening WW2 scene: Felt 3 times long than it needed to be.
    • NYC chase scene: Once he hopped on the horse I lost interest.
    • Morocco: I liked the casino fight, the rest of the car stuff after that went on too long.
    • Diving scene: This was OK, it didn't overstay its welcome, but there wasn't much tension there either.
    • Everything in Sicily and after: These felt good, individual action pieces were short and had proper stakes.

    Honestly, I started to like the movie more once the villains put on their SS uniforms and marched onto the plane. It was so ridiculous and yet compelling that I finally got excited. The ending leaned into this, and I was OK with the whole Archimedes thing.

    I was OK with Helena's character being a foil to Indy, and he smug demeanor makes sense in this context given that he used to be smug and self-assured too. However, I think her character needed some explanation. Something like the opening young Indy train scene from Last Crusade to show why she became a treasure hunter. Something to explain how a young girl surrounded by archaeological mentors doesn't absorb their morality of museums over personal profit.

  • I don't think it's helped you've had complete idiot's like Doomcock spouting their lies for months on end about the plot coupled with their misogynistic hate for women.

    I tried to stay clear of spoilers but I couldn't resist and when the Daily Mail reported towards the end of 2021 the filming of Indy and Roman soldiers, it was either a strange flashback or time travel.

    As more of the film was teased in trailers, if you know about the time travel, you could see clues in the trailers.

    I watched the film with a smile on my face and at the moment, I feel the film is very very good. I can't wait until home media and I can watch it again.

    The time travel fitted the film perfectly and didn't feel it of place but I can see how it has split the audience.

    You have to remember we've already had ghosts with the power of God, magical rocks, really really old Knights and interdimentional beings. Is time travel really that far fetched?

  • I still need to see it, but JoBlo, a channel I trust on YT gave it a good review, not as good as the first three, but better than the fourth

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