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How would you describe orientalism? I'm Asian and grew up in the US. I don't really get it, and maybe a lot of discomfort I've felt in my life would make more sense if I could identify when I see it.

Feel free to add common myths about the East that you'd like cleared up. Or how you've already cleared it up. It might help me or another reader.

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  • Strong recommendation to read Orientalism by Palestinian American scholar Edward Said, who established Orientalism as a critical concept. It's very approachable, you don't need any other background knowledge.

    • Just gonna say that Said is a very enjoyable read. I've read some of his other works (never cracked Orientalism proper, I'm bad), and he is a very good thinker.

      Here he is from "Secular Criticism" pgs 2-3. It gets a bit dense in the back half and he's still an academic, but there's always moments of lucidity like this in the Said I've read (again, can't speak to Orientalism sadly).

      The degree to which the cultural realm and its expertise are institutionally divorced from their real connections with power was wonderfully interested for me by an exchange with an old college friend who worked in the Department of Defense for a period during the Vietnam war. The bombings were in full course then, and I was naively trying to understand the kind of person who could order daily B-52 strikes over a distant Asian country in the name of the American interest in defending freedom and stopping communism. "You know," my friend said, "the Secretary is a complex human being: he doesn't fit the picture you may have formed of the cold-blooded imperialist murderer. The last time I was in his office I noticed Durrell's Alexandria Quartet on his desk." He paused meaningfully, as if to let Durrell's presence on that desk work its awful power alone. The further implication of my friend's story was that no one who read and presumably appreciated a novel could be the cold-blooded butcher one might suppose him to have been. Many years later this whole implausable anecdote (I do not remember my response to the complex conjunction of Durrell with the ordering of bombing in the sixties) strikes me as typical of what actually obtains: humanists and intellectuals accept the idea that you can read classy fiction as well as kill and maim because the cultural world is available for that particular sort of camouflaging, and because cultural types are not supposed to interfere in matters for which the social system has not specified them. What the anecdote illustrates is the approved separation of high-level bureaucrat from the reader of novels of questionable worth and definite status.

  • Orientalism is not just a set of stereotypes, but an institution for the production of knowledge. is is the creation, defining, and imagining of "The orient" which conditions knowledge of the orient with domination of the orient. this link between knowledge production and state projects was to authorize a kind of bird's-eye view of the non-Western world, one that positioned the knowing observer as superior in every respect (more rational, logical, scientific, realistic, and objective) to the object of contemplation.

    "Said also suggested that there was no simple way out of the orientalist's discourse, that one could not simply substitute "true" representations of the Orient for "false" ones. This is so because representations are more than simply passive reflections of reality. Rather, they contribute to the production of the real. This has especially been the case in a situation where epistemological issues were conjoined with the physical power and resources at the command of imperial states. As the works of those who followed Said have shown, imperial projects constructed an Orient that mimicked orientalist representations, and these constructs were, in turn, recovered by later generations of Western scholars as proof of the timeless regularities of the East"

  • read Said, there's also documentaries, interviews, and lectures where he's explained the broad strokes if you're strapped for time. it's a very worthwhile book though.

  • Orientalism is an idealist ideology. Like every other idealist ideology, it's purpose is to distract from material reality. In this case, it is used to naturalize hegemonic rule over and (desire for) imperialist domination of countries outside the imperial core. An orientalist perspective aims to paint over the real material contradiction between oppressor and oppressed, exploiter and exploited, imperial core and everyone else by instead constructing a dividing line along cultural differences. These are supposedly so impossible to bridge, that the orientalist can only stare at them utterly mystified.

    Orientalism is a cultural part of racism. By othering, it also prepares the way for more racist ideology. Racism thrives by creating an empathy gap in white people. Once the gap is established, people who are otherwise perfectly capable of feeling normal human empathy, will just stop caring once it's about the suffering of people they see as the other. Orientalism works like a wedge to widen the empathy gap. By subtle othering it makes people appear as slightly less than human in the eyes of the orientalist and thereby less deserving of empathy. Ironically, since the capacity of feeling empathy is often seen as an important part of being human, one can argue, that it's really the racist who has become slightly less human.

    To identify, if a feeling of discomfort you experience might be caused by orientalist attitudes towards Asia, Asian culture and Asian people, you could try to analyze the feeling itself more. Do you feel singled out, like the person (or media, or Institution) sees you as fundamentally different? Do they seem to have a distorted worldview, but also seem difficult to educate? Like, if you don't give them a whole lecture about how things really are, they'll never understand (but who has time for this?) And even if you do, they'll just nod and use everything you say to strengthen their worldview. Like the mere fact, that you have to explain a lot to de-warp their twisted view of other cultures, is seen as evidence for them, that the world really is split because of differences in cultures (instead of the real reason: colonial and imperialist wars).

    Reluctance to be educated about orientalist attitudes ultimately stems from the racist holding on to real material privilege, that comes from taking part in structural oppression. That's why orientalist conceptions are hard to get rid of, because they are associated with privileges for white people. Especially in the job and housing market and resulting from extracting wealth from other nations by super-exploitation and unequal exchange. By holding on to orientalism, a white worker can justify:

    • getting paid more
    • working under better conditions
    • living in a nicer neighborhood
    • receiving a constant stream of cheap goods from countries that are forbidden from establishing labour rights by institutions like the IMF and constantly get the short end of the stick in international trade
    • belonging to a block of nations, that constantly wages war on the world

    Combating orientalism is part of building class consciousness. One approach might be a metaphoricall hit on the nose, where people are made to see the limits of their own freedom in a structured, educational context. These limit experiences (Paolo Freire) can trigger a critical consciousness, where people see how they are shaped by, but also capable of transforming social structures.

  • The best way I would describe it is overemphasizing that it’s foreign, and usually part of some sinister plot. There is a large amount of overlap between antisemitic stereotypes and anti-Asian sentiment (particularly anti-Chinese) sentiment, for example.

    Sometimes when anime or pokemon was spoofed in the aughts, the animators would get kind of…weird about it. Even some parents and school faculty members would see it as a bad influence, and anime had a moral panic against it. Hell, Pokemon risked having the iconic pokemon redesigned just for the US.

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