VLC - App stores were a mistake
VLC - App stores were a mistake
VideoLAN @videolan App Stores were a mistake. Currently, we cannot update VLC on Windows Store, and we cannot update VLC on Android Play Store, without reducing security or dropping a lot of users... For now, iOS App Store still allows us to ship for iOS9, but until when?
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Reminder that VLC is on F-Droid
They've not updated it there either though. It seems to be less of a case of can't update Android and more of a case of won't update Android
From their Twitter:
If you wonder why we can't update the VLC on Android version, it's because Google refuses to let us update:
- either we give them our private signing keys,
- or we drop support for Android TV before API-30, and all our users on TV API<30 can't get fixes.
It's not much, just dozens of millions of people use Android TV before Android-11...
Maybe we should tell users to buy new TVs? #electronicWaste
I can't speak to why they're not updating on FDroid but seeing as how it's much more difficult to get people to use FDroid on Android TV, I don't think it will help them with that issue anyway.
Google requiring their private signing key is insane, and goes completely against the concept of private/public keys.
Why is Google asking for this?
See also: NSA PRISM
Member when all the companies listed released a PR statement within 24 hours of each other, all very basic and denied allowing the NSA direct access to their users?
I member.
Oh yeah, I remember that...
C-I-A Confidentiality, Integrity, Accessibility. They don't need the keys for C or A. Only one option remains. To modify the code and pass it off as code VLC wrote or signed off on.
Likely to install malware and re-sign. Brazen identity theft.
Maybe I'm wrong, they could use VLC's private keys to gobble encrypted communications too.
I didn't know F-droid was on Android TV, but it will be on mine pretty soon.
What exactly is the issue preventing them from updating the Android version?
Also, if that's the case, it sounds like "App stores were a mistake" is a bit misleading, since the particular app store isnt the problem.
Basically, modern app stores have changed how they work and now require the signing keys, VLC feel this is a bad thing and refuse to update. Banks are okay with it, but VLC feel more strongly than banks.
Banks are okay with it, but VLC feel more strongly than banks.
I mean banks are known for horrible security practices all around so that makes perfect sense.
Are they?
My bank restricts the length of my password to...16 characters, I think.
Mine only uses a 4-to-6 digit pin as a password, and sms for 2fa
Darren Kitchen from Hak5 has an amusing story about a bank teller who assured him email was entirely fine to send sPII through. "No sir, you just need to send it to us, and once we have your information then it'll be secure." No encryption. So, yes.
Also look into the Equifax security breach. Un-patched software for months.
It makes almost no sense to have a password length limit. 1_000_000, that's One Million, characters is equal to 1MiB. That's twice the length of the Lord of the Rings Trilogy and much less than most modern webpages. After hashing, which is how passwords should be stored, text length is irrelevant. All hashed inputs come out the exact same length. 65 characters for SHA256.
Very much known for their horrible security practices, yes. Absolutely.
Setting a max password length is sometimes done to prevent ddos attacks. Without it, attackers could just spam 1MB passwords constantly and force the login server to just spend all its cpu time hashing garbage.
That being said, a password limit of under 20 characters probably just means they are just storing passwords in plaintext.
In Brazil, the govt owned lottery site, created around 2015, only accepts passwords with 6 numeric digits. Your password has to be a number between 000000 and 999999. Only somewhat recently (6 months ago or so) they've added a 2FA through an email link.
Oh, said lottery is run by the biggest govt owned bank. Chances of people reusing their bank password there are very fucking high.
Absolutely. They are entrenched in their regulations so much that it takes forever to change things.
Years ago, I had an account at an american big4 bank with an 8 character password and was going through and making all my passwords unique. I was changing everything to random strings of 20-30 characters (this isnt the best practice, btw, but still better than 8chars), so when I get to this bank account it capped me at 15chars. I couldnt believe the forced low entropy they gave me for something as vital as a bank account.
I asked them why, and basically they said their system would break with anything over 15chars.
How many wrong guesses were you allowed before the system would lock your account?
Back then? Who knows
The equivalent of a 20-30 character random password with numbers and characters is a 7-11 word passphrase. Seeing how passphrase generators default to 4-5 words (equivalent to 11-14 characters) what you did isn't so bad
Be your own bank, use monero.
Show me a legitimate vendor that accepts Monero as payment.
it's really sad that all your comments are getting downvotes while advocating for a free and open and private/anonymous payment system. this is why we wont succeed in the long term, our own community fights us on it.
Who do you think makes the decisions for a bank?
The person writing the Android app?
Or the person who just wants customers to be able to access the app and use the services?
Banks have laws and regulations that they must abide by to secure the access to and information of customer accounts. A security team will surely have to sign off on whatever the app developer or customer experience manager wants to implement.
Banks have laws and regulations that they must abide by
Wait, did i step into an alternate universe? Did i escape the shadow realm? I'm free! I escaped the worst timeline!
How do y'all spell berenstain?
Isn't that how fdroid worked for a long time?
Edit: although it doesn't make sense to me for play store to do the same without the source code available
Edit 2:
The reason is that they forced new apps AND apps for Android TV to use App Bundles https://developer.android.com/guide/app-bundle This type of release cannot be installed as it but can be used to generate the apk files. In order to do so, the Play Store has to sign on the fly.
Not buying it. They could let the dev sign evey combination before uploading. They'll be caching them anyways
Traditionally Fdroid signs every app. Not with the developers key. The future are reproducible builds. https://f-droid.org/2023/01/15/towards-a-reproducible-fdroid.html this is a futuristic app store, not what google has.
Uploading your signing keys sounds like Windows uploading your bitlocker keys
Banks probably don't use it google's signing process.
Banks aren't run by the people that develop the apps. They have no idea what a signing key is, they just want the app available and updated.
In addition to the private key thing, the Play Store is requiring them to drop support for APIs older than API 30 unless they provide the key.
Which in effect means VLC can no longer be updated on AndroidTVs running Android 11 or earlier.
Which is millions of customers, according to VLC
Shit, my own TV is not even on android 10
I know at least one person who's phone isn't even on version 10.
Poorly written post ..
VLC don't update on Fdroid, Fdroid compile all the apps on their repo (the one that comes with the app). Fdroid do some checks on the updated app before they compile it, so it's always a little behind the main release.
Edit: it could also be that VLC haven't yet released the updated app (and in particular its source), so Fdroid have nothing to work with.
I just feel it doesn't make sense to moan unless you have releases you're unable to deploy.
I agree, I mean it kind of sounds like they have something dodgy they're about to put out but they're playing silly buggers and trying to deflect the blame, else they would have released already and pointed to the lack of a store release as the stores' problem.
I don't even think it's that. I think it's simply a case of them becoming complacent and now they're scrambling for excuses. VLC has stood still for a long time. Fan sub groups now recommend MPV on Windows and on Android VLC is showing its age. They speak of not wanting to abandon old users on legacy hardware, but what about old users on modern hardware who have been left feeling abandoned by how buggy the software is? When you dig into things, it doesn't look like anyone is doing VLC full-time and alternative projects are more lucrative and that's fine. Just say that. Even the other day, when they spoke of their new plans, once you got past the headline, all the plans were sane and made perfect sense, some more than others. I think they're just a bit embarrassed.
Last update 2/23/23 what am I missing?
It's the same version that's on the Play Store.
Which is current according to their site, 3.5.4
I can't read archive.is links
I don't dispute that
I am not trying to argue but what is the issue? The site shows the same release as F-Droid.
Ugh, I'm biased and so I don't really want to answer but will try. According the VLC, the reason for them becoming so terrible as a media player is because they can't update their app. Now as you and me can both clearly see, the latest version available is the version that is in the app store and on F-Droid. If they were crying about not being able to update and had a version or two that they were unable to upload, it would make sense. But nope, they have nothing beyond what they have. Add to that, if you look at their forums, lots of people have been raising issues. One very handsome man even posted this in October
VLC was once the best in class. Not only was it a great piece of legacy software, the Android team were so passionate that they took that reputation and all the expectations that go along with it and exceeded it.
But as time has gone on, it's just started to languish. If you attempt to rewind a few too many times, the video freezes and you get audio. You can't play a folder on a NAS without creating a playlist. You play a folder locally without VLC losing its place. Every time the screen goes off, it needs to scan the device anew. And despite being at the forefront of Holo Design and Material Design 1, it's yet to implement Material You.
It feels like VLC for Android has been forgotten...
To which their response was to ask for logs, despite the fact that the issues can be reproduced on every device I've ever tried.
I play NAS(smb) folders without a playlist all the time, but the rest are issues I have experienced.
Nice reach