This doesn't legalize weed, but arguably it's a step in the right direction.
I know this might sound strange but autistic people are roughly 3x more likely to be LGBT so you could consider going to an LGBT meetup. I'm neurodivergent and LGBT and that certainly matches my experience.
I am more than happy to be preachy about ending the suffering and abuse of literally billions of animals.
Listen, I appreciate someone who is at least not hostile towards vegans, but I hate this whole "I respect what vegans eat, so they should respect what I eat". Sir, you are eating an animal that was most likely tortured and abused its entire life up until the point it was murdered
What if my dietary preference was cannibalism? Then would it be okay to shit on my dietary preference?
Not eating animals isn't a dietary stance, it's an ethical stance.
I believe it! I had two types and they were god awful, but I'd be willing to give it another shot
That's funny about cream cheese, I have mostly heard complaints about vegan cream cheese. Maybe I haven't had the right brand yet but of the three types I tried I wasn't a big fan.
Updated the list! My girlfriend has celiac's disease and those usually aren't gluten free so I don't have them often
Same, I preferred plant milk to real milk for a few years before I went vegan.
Pre-note: When I mention "imitation products", I mean a food item that is trying to exactly replicate a non vegan item. Something like a black bean burger is not an imitation production, it's just an alternative.
I was bored so I started creating a tier list of vegan products and how closely they imitate non vegan products. I was trying to keep the list genericized with less emphasis on specific brands, but for some items the brand was really important.
What would you move around? What would you add? I only have a few items so far. I'll update the list as comments come in.
---
S tier - practically indistinguishable
- Beef burgers (impossible, beyond)
- Breakfast sausages (impossible, beyond)
- Chicken nuggets/patties
- Mayo
A tier - you can tell it's different but it's just as good
- Queso dip (cashew based)
- Ground beef (impossible, beyond)
- Egg (just egg)
- Butter
- Milk
- Ice cream
B tier - you can tell it's different and it's a slight downgrade
- Deli cheese slices (some brands are C or F)
C tier - you can tell it's different and it's okay but a significant downgrade
- Cream cheese (most brands)
- Pizza
F tier - you can tell it's different and it's not good
- Beef jerky
First off, I want to point out that I am totally on team /c/fuckcars. I highly believe in transit, walking, and biking.
That being said, I think it's fair to say that:
- Cars aren't fully going away anytime soon
- Even in our wildest dreams, it still makes sense for cars to be usable in some way, just that the other transport methods are highly prioritized.
So the discussion I want to have is about parking garages, and the hate I see towards them from the urbanist community.
I feel like parking garages vaguely align with urbanist views, because they are high density, and they allow someone to drive to a general area after which they can do the rest of their transportation via other methods.
To put it into perspective, I'd rather have 1-3 dense parking garages in a neighborhood than have street parking along all the roads plus wide open parking lots around grocery stores and whatnot.
I understand this is a lesser of the two evils discussion but it seems to me like parking garages are the clear winner.
I feel like that's a common trend with vegan food. Take a delicious food item and overuse it until it's almost disgusting. I love hummus but I can imagine if I ate it all the time I would get sick of it. I'm like that a little bit with mushrooms, I love mushrooms but eating a ton of them makes them gross for me.
I think something sorta unique about hummus that makes it really popular is that it's a vegan protein source that is served cold and can surprisingly substitute meat and cheese well. Like you mentioned about sandwiches, you can take out the deli meat and cheese and replace it with hummus and it still tastes delicious. Most vegan protein sources are cooked and served warm, or don't taste well with garden vegetables (like peanut butter).
I think I'm very okay with admitting that I probably just haven't had good falafel yet. But I'll make more effort to do so based on everyone's comments!
From a taste perspective, umami.
From a health perspective, eating more protein is really good for satiety and therefore weight loss. Personally, when I don't go out of my way to incorporate extra protein sources, I usually just don't feel satisfied and full. I understand and recognize that you literally don't need a ton of extra protein to be healthy, but I feel best when I have it.
Honestly, I in general don't really like when a meat is substituted for a food that is not a primarily protein source. Like replacing meat for cauliflower or jackfruit, as opposed to something with legumes or lentils
I've never tried a durian but it's kind of tempting, bucket list item for sure. What do you hate about it?
That's fair, as someone who went vegan recently I quite enjoy a couple meat substitutes. I imagine someone who's been vegan for a while doesn't care for them much though.
I really like impossible ground beef and its derivatives (meatballs, burgers). This has been my main way of convincing my friends they could maybe go vegan, all but one of my really picky friends still enjoy these. But the vast majority of vegan imitation meats I don't care much for.
I think there are a few spots where vegan cheese works.
There's a couple simple parmesan cheese recipes that are pretty much just blended cashews, nooch, and seasonings that I enjoy on spaghetti. I'm sure it wouldn't fool anybody but it works like a charm for me.
I also think you can make queso dips pretty well, the main ingredient usually being blended cashews or blended potatoes and carrots.
Sorry for bringing up cashews again but you can also make a really good cashew ricotta that's a good spread on crackers.
I tend not to enjoy the imitation cheeses. I prefer just going all in on the nuts and enjoying the final product as it's own unique item.
I've never been all that fond of falafel. I feel like I would like it in theory but when I eat it it's just, meh.
I recently bought some multi grain cheerios (no honey in them) that I thought were vegan friendly. After finishing the box, I realized that they fortify it with vitamin D3, sourced from sheep wool.
Shame because they seemed like a healthy, plant based source of whole grains.
I somehow only just learned that daisy chaining all of your guitar pedals with the same power cable can cause extra noise. I don't have that many pedals right now which is probably why I didn't notice it.
I recognize it's probably more important for recording than for live playback, but are isolated power supplies worth it? It's a hefty price to pay.
Okay but there's a moral hierarchy when it comes to eating meat. Humans used to hunt, meaning we would kill animals that lived natural lives. Not to mention, we would typically target animals that were older or sickly, because we would have a harder time killing animals that are in their prime.
That's so much different from modern day agriculture practices. We raise animals in fences so tight they can't turn their heads, and feed them nasty stuff. We abuse the shit out of them until they reach the point where we deem them the most profitable then we kill them. There's nothing natural about that.
Also, it's really hard to know for sure, but we have a good amount of evidence that humans didn't eat that much meat. First of all, the animals we hunted wouldn't be nearly as fat as the animals we eat today. Secondly, there's evidence that many humans ate roughly 100g of fiber per day, which is not possible if you had any serious amount of meat. Humans ate a lot of plants. 100g of fiber is an insane amount of plants.
Honestly I feel like the idea of "there is no ethical consumption under capitalism" is so lame. Like I understand that you could find something technically ethically wrong with everything, but that statement just feels like a way for people who don't want to give up certain things to justify themselves.
Capitalism, especially modern day capitalism where the government and companies collaborate, does lead to a lot of ethical issues. And yes, I understand that it is not liveable to give up everything that is unethical. But you can still have boundaries.
I mean like, buying oats and grains from a grocery store, which are typically grown domestically, compared to buying dead abused animals or bananas from a company that uses slave labor. Those are totally different things.
If you prioritize buying things that are made in countries that have better labor laws, and avoid animal products, then that's a pretty damn good start.
I mean, most vegans would still commend your effort to reduce animal product consumption.
But from a moral standpoint, simply eating less animal products really doesn't have much value. Imagine using your argument for other moral dilemmas.
"Racism is wrong, so I reduced the amount of racial slurs I use to only 1/3"
"Rape is wrong, so I only rape on Mondays now" (in reference to meatless Mondays)
I hate to be so militant about it, but you either think animal abuse is acceptable or you don't.
Now, what I do think could be a moral standpoint, if you really want to still be able to eat meat, is to only eat "humane" meat. I put "humane" in quotes because even farmers with the best intentions are still killing animals young. I don't personally believe any animal product can be humane, but even then I can recognize that any animal that was raised on a pasture and ate real food is more ethical to eat than one in a factory.
So if you genuinely only ate pasture raised beef and chicken (and you were sure about it), then I would say that is quite honorable.
Hi /c/vegan,
I just picked up tacos from some cheap Mexican place. They don't really do anything to cater to vegans but in the past, they basically just gave me extra rice and beans and removed any cheese, cream, or meat.
Today I ordered and they put sour cream on it. I know that this place doesn't have a vegan sour cream, so it was a mistake.
For a second I thought I wouldn't eat it, but I got in a moral debate in my head and decided that at this point, the damage is already done, and I tried my best to scrape off all the sour cream and ate the tacos.
Obviously I still consumed a decent bit of sour cream which makes me sad, but I don't know, I couldn't see it being more moral to not eat it. And I don't want to call them back and harass some minimum wage workers about it either, since they've gotten it correct in the past.
TL;DR: Cheap takeout had sour cream in it, would you scrape it off and still eat it? Throw it away? Demand a refund?
I wish this was true. I have some pet lizards I got before I went vegan, two of them are omnivores (blue tongue skink and Argentine black and white tegu). They can't be vegan. I mean, honestly, if there was a large scale effort to research it, I bet we could come up with a suitable vegan diet for them, but I don't think anyone will put a bunch of resources into that.
Hi /c/vegan,
I'm a baby "vegan", just started about a month ago. I started watching the YouTuber MicTheVegan as my main influence.
I've been really working on and developing my belief system. The issue is, my belief system so far, while it is like 97% consistent with veganism, does have some conflicts with veganism, and I think some people would say that I can't call myself a vegan because of that.
Basically, I think it's too broad to simply lump all animals into one category and say that any at all exploitation of them is wrong. Instead, I like taking a very scientific approach about what we know about different animals' cognitive and emotional abilities, and perhaps prioritize different groups of animals differently.
While I'm still developing my belief systems, here's a basic rundown of it:
Tier 1: Primates, cetaceans (whales, dolphins), elephants, certain bird species (corvids, parrots), octopuses
These animals are highly intelligent and should never be exploited for any manner. They should not be kept as pets or in zoos (I suppose exceptions for if an animal is injured beyond repair).
Tier 2: Domesticated mammals (dogs, cats), farm animals (pigs, cows), other bird species, certain fish species (cleaner wrasse, groupers)
The only difference between these animals and tier 1 animals, is that I believe they can be kept in captivity (pets or in zoos). However, they need to be kept up to really high standards. They need a lot of space and a lot of enrichment. Yes, I currently believe that most people who keep dogs as pets do not treat them well enough, but I also believe that if you do treat them well that it is okay.
Tier 3: Reptiles, amphibians, remaining fish species.
The only difference between these animals and tier 2 animals is that I think the standard for keeping them in captivity can be slightly lowered. I say this as a reptile lover, I have a couple lizards as pets. These animals still need very high standards for treatment, but I believe it's okay to keep them in "cages" (really terrariums and aquariums). Basically, the science we have says that these animals just don't need the same level as enrichment. Some lizards will literally sit in one spot for days. And yes, I highly believe that these animals are abused in reality. Many people keep these animals in far too small enclosures, among other problems.
The discussion of whether or not it's okay to breed these animals is highly nuanced, but I know with reptiles and amphibians, they really don't have any connection to their offspring so I don't think it's unethical to separate them. Some reptiles who lay eggs will even lay eggs regardless of if they are fertilized or not. I haven't made my mind up about it, but I think you could make an argument that you could ethically breed reptiles, maybe even argue that allowing them to breed let's them live a more natural life.
Tier 4: Insects, arachnids
Okay this is where a lot of vegans will lose me. These animals should absolutely never be tortured, but I personally think that they can be ethically farmed and consumed. I think these animals have simple enough brains that their quality of life when in a farmed environment really isn't that much different than their natural lives. I personally don't eat bugs, but I feed them to my lizards. That being said, I still think they deserve a decent amount of space, some enrichment, and a cruelty free life up until their death.
Tier 5: Bivalves (clams, mussels), annelids (earthworms), sponges.
Once again will get some hate for it, but these animals I also believe can be farmed and with even less consideration than the tier 4 animals. I don't really think these animals need any laws protecting them. They don't have central nervous systems.
Animal I'm not sure about: Crustaceans (somewhere between tier 3 and tier 4), Many fish species need more research (but I do standby that some fish, like carp and goldfish, belong in my tier 3).
I'm curious what other vegan's thoughts are about this. Can I not call myself a vegan because of this?