Involuntary vegan (health reasons) since 2018 here. I thought that I would lose al muscle as a vegan but I haven't noticed any difference there. What I did notice was vastly increased stamina and much better temperature regulation (not bothered by cold in Wyoming of heat in Florida). This is purely anecdotal, do with it as you wish.
I just happen to eat a vegan diet because I travel a lot and refuse to pay people to do things to animals that I wouldn't feel morally comfortable doing myself. Maybe if I settle down somewhere, I would find a farm that allows me to personally verify the ethical treatment of the animals. I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything, though. I'm in great shape, not deficient in anything, and am routinely assumed to be 10 years younger than I am.
From my experience, the people who think meat is required to be healthy usually have the worst diets and are addicted to eating the most low quality processed garbage meat available. It's never people in good shape that go on and on about how crucial meat is.
I’m really looking forward to cultured meats for similar reasons. I take no issue with one animal (human) hunting another wild animal to eat its meat for sustenance - that’s just biology bro - but our farming practices have just become insanely abhorrent with regards to animal ethics. I can’t wait until some bioengineer makes my minced meat in a lab with no animal cruelty involved because while I hate torturing animals, I love me some meat.
Sounds like the health reasons were good then
Meat-eating gains are stolen valor apparently.
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That's a hot take I'd expect to hear from a 12 year old.
No, the person is right. It's realy fucked up to eat and kill another sentient beeing to feed yourself, if your could just as easy not do so.
So you think grass and cows are comparable here? I'd be careful to judge others people's intelligence if I where you.
Raising non-human animals ends up taking more plants anyway because they eat a lot of feed who's energy is mostly lost. So if one were concerned with plants, eating plants directly results in fewer plants being killed
Grass don't have muscles. Checkmater hater. Better go train your brain muscles.
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What about the shit we feed that grass uh?!! We should all be eating shit instead of taking the hard work of the grass
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Wild fruit (e.g. fruit that hasn't been cultivated though centuries of botany) is trees tricking you to eat its seeds and poop them out in fertilizer. But those seeds tend to be big and wreak havoc with your digestive system.
True Facts gets into all this.
Plant bebes
Gets complicated when you have empathy for plants too. 👀
Raising non-human animals ends up taking more plants anyway because they eat a lot of feed who's energy is mostly lost. So if one were concerned with plants, eating plants directly results in fewer plants being killed
Fungus based diet it is
But see, the fungus can communicate too.
I guess it's down to butthole sunning and air to sustain ourselves.
They are as alive as the plants. But maybe mushrooms, like fruit, are intended to be eaten, to spread the spores. 👀 🍄
As others have mentioned, eating fruits and fungi don’t kill the organism, and per my understanding it’s the same for vegetables where you pick something off the plant to eat
But if that were the argument, then you don't need to be vegan, but vegetarian. Milking a cow doesn't kill it.
I personally think that the animal exploitation argument is the strongest for veganism or vegetarianism, not any of the ones appealing to some naturalistic rule or that no organism should be exploited. Yes, animals provide humans a very efficient nutritional source that plants can't give us, but a) we stopped eating the majority parts of animals that are not meat, and b) that doesn't justify animals raised in cruelty, without any regard for their wellbeing, standing in their own feces all day and so on.
Our current scientific understanding of plants is that since they don't have a nervous system, they can't feel pain. And that while they react to stimuli (facing the sun for example) they don't exhibit any form of consciousness. Unfortunately there have been more and more claims to the contrary, but not backed up by studies.
It is the exploitation that's wrong. That goes for animals as well as plants. If we can avoid that then things would be a lot better
Plants never complain, unlike all of us whiny primates. In a way, they could be far more moral creatures than anything else we're aware of.
Mother Nature is cruel and we are at the pinnacle. It’s kind of cool to see such sentiments that are so uncharacteristic for the cold, dark universe. I wonder if there is a single place out there where similar behaviours could develop. Would anyone else view them as we do or is it intrinsically human?
Are aliens cannibals?
I mean. Humans are mid on the asshole olympics.
Just take chimps for example. The males much rather eat their own child after the mother dies, than take care of it themselves. Females only can take care of one child at a time. So they are cool watching an orphan die from neglect or cannibalism.
Take dolphins. The males gang up on females to force her to mate. If she refuses, they drown her.
Zebra's and many other species go out of their way to kill foals just so that the mother goes into estrus sooner. Giving the male a chance to force copulation.
Storks build their nest above croc infesed land/water. This is to scare off predators. They also have the habit of evicting young that are either too weak (due to disease or bullying) or are oo aggressive (too much of a bully to other nest mates). The parents can't feed every chick, especially as they get bigger. So they get rid of some. Resulting in a mutualistic relationship between the croc and stork. It's a lot more common than you'd think.
Lions form coalitions to kill lion cubs, just to get lionesses to stop lactating and go into estrus sooner. Lionesses sometimes kill their own young if they have only 1 cub left. Better kill it, go into estrus and cook up a new batch sooner.
Beachmasters are known to crush newborn elephant seals to death. Simply because they were too close to their mother who just gave birth to it. Ever seen one of these jerks run? It's glorious.
Parasite birds form mobs to destroy nests that managed to evict their chicks.
And insects aren't much better either. Sadly I forget the name of the bug that pins down a female, forces copulation and then throws her out of the tree. I get the pinning part, but the throwing out of the tree bit just seems extra.
Then there is ofcourse rampant cannibalism in insects and spiders. Females produce more offspring if they eat the male. And some spider species, the female turns herself into a meal for her children in a feezing frenzy.
Humans aren't so bad.
Given how powerful and effective the strategy of cooperation and trust seem to be in humans, I find it extremely likely to be a common strategy.
I also don't think aliens lacking empathy would generally be capable of forming civilizations, so they'd be stuck at the hunter gatherer stage. It is almost a truism that amongst us humans, as empathy and trust in eachother breaks down, civilization stops functioning.
If you lean towards moral truth being at least somewhat universal, then this wouldn't be intrinsically human at all.
I think morality is a human social construct. A very beautiful one though but one that can only exist to various degrees if there is certain level of comfort and prosperity.
Ultimately it is merely a tiny splinter in the vast cosmos. I like it nevertheless and sticking to it makes me feel good. I like to get high
"Eat its heart and gain its power!"
The Most Dangerous Game: Ronnie Coleman
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Still 🤡
