Today I Learned @lemmy.world randomaccount43543 @lemmy.world 1 yr. ago

TIL Soviet cosmonauts carried a shotgun on space missions

It was purportedly (and probably in actuality) intended as a survival aid to be used after landings and before recovery in the Siberian wilderness, although allegedly was intended as a defensive weapon against in-space attacks by the US space program.

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The attack in space angle was probably just to convince some manager.

The survival in Siberia is completely valid. US retrieves their astronauts in the ocean, but Soviet Russia didn't/doesn't have such a worldwide navy, so Siberia it is. It could take days for the cosmonauts to be recovered, so it was expected they might need to defend themselves against wildlife or even hunt.
- I think every astronaut that embarked in the Soyuz spacecraft had to go through a wilderness survival training.
  
  I know the french astronaut Thomas Pesquet had to survive a week in Siberian first in winter before embarking on the Soyuz.
Because space is haunted. And buckshot's superior spread helps ensure a hit while spinning around in zero-g. Solid slugs would go straight through the soyuz walls, duh.
- It's the sequel we've always wanted to Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter.
  
  As long as it's about Buzz Aldrin and they're Nazi ghosts.
allegedly was intended as a defensive weapon against in-space attacks by the US space program.

??? If it was for in-space attacks, wouldn't it be more logical to mount a gun outside of ship 😆?

It was intended as a survival aid for emergency landings. It's not a shotgun, but a three barrel pistol (but it can shoot both normal rounds and shells). Another interesting detail - it's buttstock is a folding machete.

TP-87 was invented by request of A. Leonov after emergency landing of 'Voshod-2' where cosmonauts Leonov and Belyaev had to survive 3 days in wild taiga forest for a rescue team to retrieve them.
- Love that story. Reminds me of Factorio, or Satisfactory or something.
  
  Satisfactorio ?
Would this actually work effectively in space?
- Why wouldn't it?
  
  Ed: the only thing that might not work is gunpowder in vacuum due to lack of oxygen, but gunpowder has oxidiser included, so yes it would.
  
  I had to look up whether gunpowder requires oxygen to burn (it doesn't)
  
  Heat dissipation is an issue since there's no air around to cool the barrel, although for this three shot weapon (two shotgun one rifle) it wouldn't be a problem. This gun is mostly to fend off bears when you land in Siberia.
  
  Recoil would be a removed though lol
  
  According to GPT4 :
  
  Yes, a shotgun could function in space. Firearms, including shotguns, rely on self-contained oxidizers in their ammunition to ignite the propellant, so they do not require atmospheric oxygen to fire.
  
  However, the lack of air would mean there's no medium to carry the shockwave, so the gun's report would not be audible. Additionally, the recoil could cause more significant uncontrolled movement due to the lack of air resistance and gravity to stabilize the shooter. The cold temperatures in space might also affect the mechanical parts, potentially leading to jamming or other issues if the weapon isn't specially designed for such an environment.
- Yes, I guess? But firing a gun inside a spacecraft would be a bad idea... and also firing it while spacewalking would be a bad idea unless you were very sure that you were very well braced & tethered.
  
  Or the gun is just an emergency propulsion system in case you lose your tether....
  
  You could load it with very small, light, or soft pellets, they don't need to be very damaging to make a hole in a suit which would be near certainly fatal.
- Well, considering that many early spacecraft and space stations were running oxygen rich atmospheres, it would probably mean the end of anyone involved in a rather spectacular fireball.
  
  I'd kind of hope everyone would know better than that after the disastrous Apollo I fire.
Long-time space journalist Jim Oberg called it “a deluxe all-in-one weapon with three barrels and a folding stock that doubles as a shovel and contains a swing-out machete.”
- You'd think it was invented by the Swiss.
It could also be a handy final solution if you got trapped in space with no chance of rescue or return.
They say it was because their landing in the wilds of Siberia may require defense against wildlife. This is not true. The truth is that they have seen what resides in space, and would not venture into it's laid unarmed.
- So... They watched Aliens?
Possibly also for suicide if you get into a situation where you would slowly suffer to death?
- I'd rather take hypoxia atleast then it not technically suicide.
  
  A gunshot wound to the head is also not suicide.
  
  If however both the gunshot wound and hypoxia are self inflicted then it is suicide, regardless if you pull the trigger or open a valve.
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I can't seem to read the article, so forgive me if they answer this question, but how would a gun work in space? Most firearms I'm familiar with use oxidation reactions to propel ammunition. Were the shells filled with self-oxidizing propellant, or did they just use a completely different system?
- Fun fact! All gunpowder is self oxidizing
  
  I guess today is a learning day for all of us! I knew gunpowder contained nitrates, but I didn't realize that was its purpose, or that it allowed it to work in a vacuum.
- Pretty much anything explosive need to be self oxidizing. If air can't get in to continue to feed the burning of the material (which never can during an explosion) than the oxygen needs to come from another source.
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They were called spacial operations.

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