I'm begging you to learn how to use this term.
I'm begging you to learn how to use this term.
Tankie's original use was for British communists who supported Soviet military expansion. In the modern sense, it is used to describe communists who are authoritarian-apologists. For example, a communist who romanticizes the Soviet Union or makes excuses for the Uyghur genocide is a tankie. I've also seen it stretched to include militant anti-capitalists, or more commonly, "militant," anti-capitalists who call for violent resistance to capitalism from the safety of a keyboard.
Democratic-Socialists are not tankies. Socialists are not tankies. I don't even think most communists qualify as tankies. Criticizing Democrats does not make you a tankie. Condemning Israel's human rights violations does not make you a tankie. Voting third party doesn't make you a tankie. I see this term used here every day, but never correctly.
[reads post] Yep, I'm using it right.
What do all serious auths have in common? The plan to use mass murder, at some point or another, as a means to an end. Unironically, my favorite thing about Tankies is how they'll go from "communists aren't violent murderers actually" to "you'll get the bullet, too" in the span of two posts.
To clarify my position, I'm more closely aligned with anarcho-communists than any other serious political movement. I just think authoritarians of all stripes suck.
The plan to use mass murder, at some point or another, as a means to an end.
But there is something that separates a communist from a tankie. It isn't the willingness to use violence, but their willingness to do so against their beliefs if it benefits "the communist side" even though it is an oppressive act.
Supporting violent resistance in Gaza doesn't make someone a tankie, but supporting Russia's invasion of Ukraine does.
I've not used it for anyone who wasn't an authoritarian apologist, or who I meant to accuse of being an authoritarian apologist.
That's exactly what a tankie would say!
True, however equally true
I got called a tankie for complaining about the lack of regulations when that lead tainted applesauce story came out.
Calling someone a tankie is just scraping the bottom of the barrel. It's all they have.
I got called a fascist for saying I’m voting for Biden.
You got called a fascist becasue you wrote:
"12 percent of Bernie’s supporters stayed home in 2020."
and
"Why would I lecture anyone fucking over leftists? Fuck socialism."
Which is are pretty much rightist talking points.
Edit: You also said that leftists and POC need to be "put in their place" whatever that means, so I'm not surprised you got called that.
Well this is gonna tee up a measured and rational discussion.
Look man, 90% of this community is liberals and leftists picking fights with each other. If I can at least get them to start using the right words when the do it, I'll call it a win.
And you think this post is gonna produce that outcome, do you 🙂
(Look man, I'm kind of just messing with you. I can sympathize with your mission. But I do think the reality is that language changes over time and in the present day, tankie means "authoritarian pro-Russia pro-China leftist" and there's not much you or I can do about it. I also think that trying to buck the even-more-overarching problem of the whole community being full of "YOU'RE NOT TELLING ME WHAT'S WHAT I'M TELLING YOU WHAT'S WHAT" mindset means that anything you're trying to tell people about how to use their language is doomed to failure unless what you're saying already matches with what they've decided is God's truth.)
In the modern sense, it is used to describe communists who are authoritarian-apologists.
When I first wondered “wtf is a ‘tankie’?” I was lucky enough to find a source that defined the term in a similar way. Still, I appreciate the verification, and you’re right - it’s often used incorrectly.
Tankie: a Leftist that may self-identify as a Communist, or erroneously, a Socialist. Typified by their usage of a Hammer and Sickle or Joseph Stalin as their profile picture, these poor souls believe that the only way to achieve a Proletarian Revolution is to centralize power and control the flow of information similar to Stalin's Russia or modern day China. This includes the threat or actual use of violence on their own citizens in order to maintain their version of the status quo. The ownership of the means of production will be nationalized. 3rd party government oversight would not have even been thought of. Basically fascists but with a red coat of paint.
I mean, that's the right ballpark...I'd probably shorten it to, "A communist or far-left activist that defends or supports authoritarian regimes that align with their political ideology," but that's just me.
"erroneously a socialist" oh come on. All communists are socialist but not all socialist are communist. You can't just change definitions of words because you are a left-anticommunist. I don't even know what to say besides read a book.
Did you read the self identify part?
I was called a tankie 2 days ago. I'm an anarchist who occasionally is known to get gets into flame wars with the tankies...
Tankie is such a specific term that I've only ever seen used in leftist circles until recently. At first it was kinda funny to watch normie liberals mistake it for a, "Bernie Bro," synonym, but lately it's just getting annoying.
I'm sorry sir have you considered going back to China and/or Russia?
Fat chance. Liberals' understanding of a term only extends to how useful it is to their political agenda (maintaining the status quo).
It's the same reason they mindlessly equate the term "radical" with extremism (usually the right-wing kind).
There is a simple rule to seperate tankies from the left;
if they call for nuking an entire hemisphere of the planet or openly call for genocide, that's a tankie.
Tankie has become a thought terminating cliche. Just call someone a tankie and any debate is over. You are correct and you can ignore any opinion that doesn't align with your own.
No need to debate strangers online. Nobody debates in good faith and nobody is listening.
Words change meaning over time. This is how language works. What it used to mean isn’t what it means now.
Yeah, that's why I outlined how this term went from describing British communists who supported the Soviet's use of tanks during the Hungarian Revolution to generally pro-authoritarian communists to communists who call for violent resistance to capitalism (especially online). There's a difference between a word's meaning shifting over time and someone misusing or misunderstanding a word so badly they've lost its meaning.
Again, the definition of the word changed. It’s how these things work. Now, it seems to pretty much describe trendy socialists that pick a hot button single issue to be upset about- troll the internet with noses about it, and pretend they actually could have point on a map to where said events are happening six months ago.
I'm what most people would describe as left, and authoritarianism is the antithesis of what I believe in.
Calling every leftist a tankie removes nuance to political discourse and groups people together who don’t believe the same things, whose views are sometimes totally opposed.
It’s worth pushing back on how the meaning of this word is changing. OP is not arguing it should only apply to British communists, only that it should not be used as a cudgel against every leftie.
edit: spelling
Right. So as an example, "Tankie" currently means "anyone not overjoyed at Biden's support for genocide."
Socialists: 🫱 anyone to their right
"Is this a Fascist?"
The difference is that we have an actual fascist as the frontrunner in one of the two viable US political parties.
But sure, bOtH SidEs.
Sounds like you're projecting.
You try to overthrow one legitimate government and say you're going to put your opponents in prison or to death and make death threats to any election worker who doesn't get with the program and say the country is overrun with vermin and all of a sudden people start throwin around such hurtful words
Pretty much. At least here on lemmy.