I’m surprised that nobody defended the Western Allies’ takeover of former Axis empires yet. I am going to write this to prevent any attempts:
The Western Allies reused the Empire of Japan’s system of forced prostitution.
Italian anticommunists pardoned Fascists while punishing thousands of partisans; there was no equivalent to the Nuremberg Trials for the Italian Fascists; the liberal bourgeoisie refused to prosecute Fascists for their atrocities in Ethiopia; and there were continuities between Fascism & the post‐1945 Italian police.
When the Western Allies took Algeria from the Axis, they let the fascists continue running the internment camps; important elements of the Fascist era survived in postwar France.
The U.S. Army continued keeping Jews in the Axis’s concentration camps (‘We appear to be treating the Jews as the Nazis treated them, except that we do not exterminate them.’ — Harry Truman, Sept. 1946); West Germany’s régime was polluted with surviving Axis personnel; fascist elements survived in West Germany.
Somebody could argue that there was no alternative to the Western Allies, but plenty of partisans were active in France, for example, and the Eastern Allies could have reached every Axis‐occupied region given enough time.
I’ll freely concede that the Western Allies were better than the Axis… but that’s not exactly saying much.
@yogthos
well... if the map also shows where the US has acted clandestinely for its own imperialist purposes, the map gets a little redder.@yogthos Your map is wrong. This comment from the linked thread probably sums it up best...
"loaExMachina
@sh.itjust.worksImage says “Has invaded since PRC was founded”, not “is occupying right now”, don’t try to change the terms of the debate when contradicted. You still could’ve made a point that China invaded much fewer countries than the US, but at least try to have an accurate map or the accurate words."
@yogthos Technically, they have also invaded themselves.
China doesn't occupy every nook and cranny of the oceans and waterways on the planet. Whoever made this chart is a fuckin moron. Humans cannot realistically engage in long term oceanic invasion and occupation.
Look, can't we agree that neither country gives a shit about the working class? Nation states are so 20th century. Why not try something new and try dissolving the state and self organizing into communes that best reflect our beliefs and values?
That said... What do the different shades of colors mean in the top image? Only half fucked over?
Is the blue in the bottom image the seas and oceans of the world or areas that China claims as the South China sea?
Ramming Philippines ships in Phillipines waters is hardly peaceful conduct.
Don't get me wrong, USA are horrific and absolutely need to be held to account but that doesn't mean China are good guys. All major world powers act like dicks to maintain their own interests.
Oh, and since when is China socialist? The weather disparity there is hardly people's ownership of the means of production.
@yogthos Ummm.... you sure about that?
(Also, China is not the only socialist empire in the history 😉 )
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China
This is too close to dishonest to be persuasive.
The word "occupied" is doing the heavy lifting, but saying "invaded & occupied" implies that they've done as little invading as occupying, which is not true.
The USSR isn't included, so the implication that socialism means 0 occupations is also untrue.
All states that identify as socialist have done fewer invasions than the US, as a combination of having existed for less time, having had less power during that time and -yes - having a slightly lower inclination to invade.
All powerful states abuse their power to unacceptable (if differing) degrees. That's the nature of hierarchical power. All nation states are vermin.
