Some context:
After Elmo's venture into posting anime stuff on Twitter, this feels rather tame I guess. Or I'm just too jaded to care about this timeline any longer.
I need context
This meme has gone at least a mile over my head
I have become so desensitized to the festering dumpster sludge media that the window treatment shocks me the most in this picture
Isn't that the room from the milk nazi meme ?
That image is absolutely cursed. Don't like it at all.
US conservatives look exactly the same, except without the fursuits.
For like 80 years, the west prepared for war with Russia. Russia played the long, quiet game and just parasitized our politics, and our economies. They’re winning without ever firing a shot. It’s impressive, albeit infuriating.
You give Russia too much credit.
Europe and USA put themselves on this situation all by their own stupidity.
Also greed
You're absolutely crazy if you honestly believe that. First of all, talking of "Russia" as a constant for the past 80 years when it's gone from part of the USSR, to liberal-minded capitalist country with talks of joining the EU, to fascist dictatorship just in the last 35 years. There's absolutely no "long term plan to destabilize Europe" in Russia for the past 80 years, and you're being conspiracist and throwing history out the window.
Secondly, as sadly shown in the early 20th century, Europe is more than capable of creating its own fascist movements. You say Russia has been conspiring to push fascism in Europe, but I'm Spanish and the USSR was the only country which helped the Republican struggle against fascism in the Spanish civil war, and after the fascists won in Spain (with the help of the Nazis and the italian fascists while the rest of Europe did nothing) and WW2 ended, fascist Spain was perfectly joined into the international community just a few decades afterwards.
The current far-right movements in Europe are learning their lessons from Trump and Bolsonaro, and have received most of their help and funding from within Europe and from the US rather than from Russia. They're the consequence of one and a half decades of austerity policy, where the socialdemocrats have been complicit in austerity as much as the conservative parties have been. And after corruption schemes being discovered in most christian-conservative parties in Europe, a segment of right wing that used to vote for them but lost their trust, now votes for other right wing parties, including far right. Fascism isn't a tool from Russia to destroy Europe, it's Europe destroying itself from within to further the interests of the wealthy elites.
That's right, there were no flaws in the political system invented 250 years ago and only outside actors in the last 20 years led to a conservative party vs a fascist party.
Russia is neither winning nor is their disinformation campaigns that successful. This is because despite their best efforts, when they needed their propaganda to work the most, it backfired and the west is more united than ever. Not only that but the country is basically wrecked due to the invasion of Ukraine
What? Modern Russia exists for 33 years. 80 years ago certain parlamentary union was so upset at nazis, that it destroyed them.
Also 80 years ago for that parlamentary union the lefter politician was - the better. For Putin it's opposite.
The swing right is a rejection of globalism by the people more than Russia being some amazing propaganda source. Blaming Russia absolves the globalists from responsibility though.
(((Globalism))), right?
Real conservatives: *shows school teacher*
For context schools are ultraconservative social institutions. That's what they were designed to do - preserve knowledge across generations.
All nazis that claim to be conservatives are actually nazis, not conservatives.
I feel soo confused 😐
Very American of you to not know conservatives from fascists
If there are 9 conservatives and 1 fascist sitting around a table, then there are 10 fascists sitting around that table.
So if there are 9 reformists and 1 fascist sitting around a table, would there be 10 fascists sitting around that table?
This argument is pretty dumb. If we follow this logic then American liberals are Marxist because American Marxists tend to support the DNC more often than not... But that's obviously not true, and American liberals don't support such an evil ideology.
If we follow the logic in a different route and assume that 9 racists are sitting on a table with a civil rights activist, they're all civil rights activists... But that doesn't sound right, does it?
Let's try another attempt, if 10 world leaders are in a conference somewhere. Of those leaders, 9 are liberals from democratic countries and one is a dictator, does that make all 10 of them dictators? Of course not.
The issue with this type of argument is that it's based on guilt by association, not even that actually, it's more of guilt by proximity. This is a logical fallacy for all the reasons stated in this article:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_fallacy
Let's not bring back guilt by association and doom ourselves back to the dark ages due to virtue signaling and ignorance. People should be looked as individuals and judged for their own beliefs.
There's a difference?
Fascism is more of an approach than a specific ideology. Its only core value is Strength Through Unity - but to achieve that it needs some populist values to unite the people over - which is how you get different flavors of fascism. The original Fascist Party was using nationalism. Racism is also a popular choice (fascism + racism = Nazism), and it seems like rightist values are more prune to it - but leftist values are not safe either, like we have seen in the USSR which based its fascism around socialism.
Conservatism can be a base for fascism, but like all these other values - it doesn't have to be fascist. The rule is simple:
- If you want The Gays(tm) to just stop - that's regular conservatism.
- If you want a strong leader to "stop" The Gays(tm) - that's fascist conservatism.
Please stop framing backward-looking nationalists as conservative. They don't want to conserve civil rights, environmental and protective standards, and other granted at status quo. They want society to go back to the 1930s.
Permanently Deleted
The post mentions Meloni who is nationalist (and was even fascist not too long ago). That, driven by nationalist parties, many European parties, not only conservatives, are drifting away further and further into populism is one effect of the problem of normalising populism and nationalism by the media.
Conservatives never wanted civil rights or environmental protections. What alternate dimension did you drop out of?
As I'm from Germany, our constitution was elaborated by a constituent assembly constisting in the majority of conservatives. It granted and grants a lot of civil rights which are questioned by modern day conservatives, such as the right for asylum or secrecy of mail and telephone. Starting from our first government, led by the conservative party CDU, the politics was also constantly pro-European towards integration. Also our first ministry for environment issues was established by a conservative government in 1986.
This backward-looking stupidity is a phenomenon of the last 30 years. E.g. Franz Josef Strauß, the most conservative politician I can think of, was pro technical innovation. As of today, the state of Bavaria still benefits from decisions made under his government. He would rotate in his grave if he knew how his party has become.
Conservatives, from the very beginning, were more interested in conserving their own power, while realizing hiding behind the "conserving our traditions" mask will win them a lot, besides using the "my enemy's hypocrisy is a fatal flaw of their character and ideology, my hypocrisy is human nature" tactic ad nauseum.
It would be silly to pretend the word "conservative" isn't widely understood to mean backwards-looking nationalists. But it's equally silly to call fascists conservative when we have a much better word for them.
It would be silly to pretend the word "conservative" isn't widely understood to mean backwards-looking nationalists.
I agree that it uses to be the norm now, however it was not always like this but the meaning has changed. The horse has left the barn. (Das Kind ist in den Brunnen gefallen)
But it's equally silly to call fascists conservative when we have a much better word for them.
That's my point.
