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Democracy kind of breaks down if you can't make demands anymore, since the "lesser evil" is the only viable option.
Also: elections are overrated/don't work.
If elections don't work why do republicans put so much effort into manipulating them.
Let me clarify: They do work in solidifying power structures. However, that's usually not in favour of the vast majority of people.
So when the wrong people win, elections work. But stopping the wrong people from winning totally doesn't work.
Got it. Thanks for breaking it down for me.
Yeah. Elections are tools for the powerful. True democratic power comes from organizing.
If you can't bring the Dems to stop condoning a genocide, but you have to vote for them nontheless, because orange man bad: what use is this democracy?
Post your organizing: !inperson@slrpnk.net
Invite me to a Gaza protest and if I'm in the area you'll see me there.
You're obviously doing some organizing, since you feel it's important enough that voting even to choose between two so dramatically different candidates would be, by comparison, not worth it.
Right?
I'm not located in the US, though.
Why do you spell it favour and not favor?
Because I'm notfrom the so-called US.
So what’s your motivation to try to get people not to vote in the US?
Not what I'm trying to do. I want people to focus on what in reality would improve their lives instead of focusing on shitty real-life Game of Thrones.
Just to clarify you’re not currently living in the US, right?
Get to the point (I'm waiting for a accusation of being a russian troll account, if that's what you're getting at)
You didn’t answer my question and I didn’t accuse you of being a Russian troll.
You only have this option as the final stage. You have primaries to vote for the actual better candidate.
As if the dems held actual primaries this year, lol.
Because incumbent presidents pretty much never lose.
So you agree: Dems tell people to shut up and don't make demands to their politicians, because representative democracy doesn't work and it's just a game of team A vs team B.
I mean if you want to put words in my mouth so you can win your little internet argument go ahead. It seems very important to you.
Ok, so if current presidents "never lose": what about 2020?
So, Biden has supposedly the best chance and primaries are were you make demands. Therefore: don't bother making demands to Biden. That's just your own points brought to a conclusion.
I never said primaries are where you "make demands" I literally just said it's not a strict binary choice since you get more options in the primary.
Anything else is you just making stuff up
O you admit that you actually didn't respond to the point I made in my first comment where I pointed out that democracy breaks down if you can't make demands?
Where were you in 2020?
Staying indoors. Weren't you? /j
I live in West Virginia. I've never had a primary where the winner wasn't already decided. Everyone has dropped out before it gets to me, so does my vote not matter?
We don't live in a direct democracy with instant national voting, so that's just gonna happen.
Good news is, you can do your part to convince others. Have you ever volunteered for anyone's campaign?
So the answer is no, my primary vote doesn't matter.
Well if that's all you're willing to do, then you don't matter.
Dude, look at the comment that I commented under. The context of it was that he said that the primaries were for picking better candidates, and I said the primaries don't matter, in my case.
I'm simply saying the answer to finding and fielding better candidates is not the primary, because it is inherently undemocratic process.
We do?
Yes.
The last Democratic presidential primary where the result wasn't preordained was 2008.
The primaries were not stolen from you. Bernie just isn't as popular as you wish he was.
wrong. the dnc admitted it was rigged, and a court agreed they were allowed to rig it.
The 2020 DNC primaries were pretty much decided in a state that voted for Trump so... not really.
Not at all. Just because you can use a state to gauge who the winner will be doesn't make that the state that decides it.
And I'm by no means a fan of how the DNC operates. Just pointing out you have the option.
Alright then let's make it simpler:
Was Biden the most viable candidate to win the general election out of everybody else running in the 2020 primaries?
I mean that's a matter of opinion and doesn't really have anything to do with wether you have a primary.
Yeah I know it's a matter of opinion. I'm asking what your opinion is.
Was Biden the most viable candidate to win the general election out of everybody else running in the 2020 primaries?
Who’s the president now?
I'm gonna take that as a "yes" to which I'd say: Then you have nothing to worry about. You obviously don't need my vote and can ignore me.
I’m just saying he won.
Who else do you think had a chance?
So you didn't answer my question? Why would I answer yours?
Fair point, enjoy spreading voting apathy.
Maybe Bernie will get in next time.
What you're doing is like trying to tell people to keep the kitchen clean while there's a leak in the roof you refuse to even talk about. You're spreading apathy because you refuse to acknowledge what needs to change.
Enjoy defending a garbage party, candidate, primary and the people who continue to prop it up.
So you've been incessantly writing in to your congresspeople to make demands, make sure they know where you stand on important issues, right?
Not just shitposting and encouraging people to do even less to exert control over their systems of government than the fairly minimal input-lever which is voting, right?
Right?
Right, the problem is that they just don't know what I want. Silly me.
I'm in a political group, organizing. Protests and agitation are way more effective than writing some rich fuck in congress.
Also: I'm not even a US citizen, lol.
Link me to your protest group, I am interested to support it.
I am dead serious, I've been feeling guilty that I haven't been doing enough to get personally involved in activism and I recently signed up with CCL and I'm looking today at what else I can do.
Join a union. The more radical the better. My org is located in Germany. ;)
Yo I've heard things have been pretty bad in Germany regarding the far right. Is it as bad as they say?
Yes and no. There have been mass mobilization aoainst the far right after news broke that they've conducted a secret meeting discussing how to forcibly remove unwanted people from Germany (no matter if they have citizenship). That lead to a looot of protests against the far right.
But those protests were partially conducted by the parties in power, who conduct their own racist (but less obviously so) policies.
Damn, I suppose it's better than no protest. Best of luck comrade o7
Did you see how many millions of counter protesters there were for that movement?
I actually wasn't aware of the magnitude if I'm honest, only that their were counter protests. It's why I asked
Elections did a pretty fucking good job of getting women sent to jail for having miscarriages
Yeah I saw that comment, it doesn't address the whole "one of the parties is sending women to prison for having miscarriages" thing
Why not? Is sending people to prison a progressive policy?
You don't have any idea what you're talking about, do you?
If Democrats had won in 2016, women wouldn't be getting arrested for having miscarriages in the 2020s. It really isn't hard. The election worked against the people because motherfuckers like you convinced people not to vote.
If Democrats had won in 2016, women wouldn't be getting arrested for having miscarriages in the 2020s.
You're not refuting my point by listing examples of regressive policies that are perfectly legal in the "democratic system" they are enacted in. My point is: Voting (in the real world, not in the hypothetical world, were Trump didn't become president) doesn't help improving conditions for the vast majority of the population (read: people who aren't rich).
If Trump didn't win, the so-called US would still have a deranged far-right party. Tucker Carlson, the heritage foundatio, the Koch brothers, PragerU, Matt Walsh, etc. weren't elected. Remember?
The election worked against the people because motherfuckers like you convinced people not to vote.
I didn't tell people "not to vote". I don't like telling strangers what to do. I said "voting doesn't work" (or: voting doesn't matter). There's a difference.
Trump lost the popular vote. So, technically: He got president because of the weird electoral college system (which Biden voted to uphold in congress, I think).
Also: the Democrats disenfranchised the poor population by calling white poor population racist rednecks who need to get woke, instead of helping them in their socio-economic situation. Because in the end: both democrats and republicans serve the rich.
But yeah. I "have no idea", right. /s 🙄
Democrats don't need to make life actively better than it currently is to be a better option than Republicans, who actively make life worse. That doesn't make them good, it just makes them not as bad.
You know, I'm tired and bored enough to pull a typical American take and say: why am I arguing with a German? Don't you have a wind turbine to break down for a coal mine somewhere? You should probably get back to vork
- You've confirmed the stupid American stereotype more than you intended, since I'm not a Brit, lol.
- I would really like not having to deal with the politics of the so-called "US" so much. I would gladly not bother if you yankees would stop playing world police and affecting the rest of the world so much with your failed state.
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Yeah I updated it since I noticed you aren't British, hence the jab about wind turbines being torn down for coal mines. Sorry, I'm just used to Brits being the ones bitching about America all the time
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I too would like for us to stop doing that, and letting Republicans win so that they can expand our little MIC doesn't help.
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I never said you "told" people not to vote, I said you "convinced" people not to vote–by saying ignorant shit like "voting doesn't matter."
What do you propose I do in november? Should I vote for the republican, the democrat, or neither?
hence the jab about wind turbines being torn down for coal mines
Lol. Is that the best a quick google search had to offer? ^^ I'm not claiming Germany is that much better or that voting here matters way more.
What do you propose I do in November?
Organize and don't let the republicans win where it counts: on the pavement.
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hence the jab about wind turbines being torn down for coal mines
Lol. Is that the best a quick google search had to offer? ^^ I'm not claiming Germany is that much better or that voting here matters way more.
What do you propose I do in November?
Am also agreeink with elections not work. Many people say no to elections. A vote is wasted. Look at a great leader like Putin - he needs not the many votes to stay in power.