IceBerg @ IceBerg @lemmy.world

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Joined

2 yr. ago

That's proof that there is a war on. No proof of any systematic killings. Based on Palestinian reports there are about 20000 dead, no information of course on how many of them combatants. So over the course of 3 months you have a less than 1 percent fatalities. I point you back to my meme and ask tou where's the genocide. In the ww2 bombing of dresden 25000 people were killed in just 4 attacks. Israel is doing everything possible to kill only combatants. As I mentioned earlier it is impossible to avoid civilian deaths as they are being used as human shields. Military equipment is constantly being found in hospitals, mosques, schools and under childrens beds.

The Israel government on the other hand is adamant to kill every last Palestinian or ethnically cleanse them with forced displacement. - please show your proof. And please don't give me quotes from several outliers which unfortunately have been brought recently into the Israeli government. They don't represent the majority of Israel as apperantly the multitudes cheering in the streets while the October 7th hostiges were paraded through Gaza streets represent the people of Gaza.

Ok. I assume you don't live in Gaza. Because then you'd be learning antisemitism in school: https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/eu-study-confirms-incitement-in-palestinian-textbooks

And I assume you don't go to mosque because then you'd be hearing about gharqad

And probably didn't attend these protests: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.timesofisrael.com/death-to-the-jews-chants-heard-at-berlin-pro-palestinian-rally/amp/

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/rjdkan0mp

Sure, I find it amusing that Israel is being accused of commiting genocide against the Palestinians when they have an above world average population gain (+2.3% yearly change vs. 0.83%)

Really? Has Bibi publicly stated he plans on genocide? Because Hamas has publicly stated, many many times, that the only thing they care about is the total inhalation of all non-muslims.

Why the personal attacks? I'm happy to debate any counter points you may have.

Yes. The numbers of deaths is horrifying. I agree. Israel and Palestine are at war. A war the Palestinians instigated by murdering civilians. Israel on the other hand is targeting military targets which the Palestinians have put among the civilian population. So yes, there are many many civilians being killed. As the only other option Israel has seems to be "just let the Palestinians kill you", I don't really see a way to avoid it. On October 7th the Palestinians clearly stated that the only thing they want is the inhalation of all Jews. Israel is not trying to wipe out the Palestinians, it is trying to make sure they never succeed at any such act ever again.

Genocide - the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group.

Happened in europe by the Nazis as seen by the negative population gain. Does not happen in Israel as seen by the above world average population gain.

Oooh. That's an easy one. Jewish population of europe 1935: 9.5 million Jewish population of europe 1945: 3.5 million There's the genocide.

Excellent debate. Thanks.

Ah. The genocide card. It's actually great when people bring that one up. Please check these facts: Palestinian population 1948: 1.37 million Palestinian population 2023: 5.5 million in Israel, about 14.2 million world wide. Here's a meme concept for you, the one with the dog from rick and morty: "where's the genocide summer?"

Btw, for real genocide: Jewish population of europe before ww2: 9.5 million Jewish population after ww2: 3.5 million See how that works?

"there still exists Palestine and its people". No. Before the state of Israel there was the british occupation. Before that the turkish ottoman empire. Before that there was an Egyptian rule and so on and so on. There were wars and the rule of this specific piece of land changed. At no point in history was there ever a Palstinian country. There is no Palestinian that can trace his lineage to some Palestinian hundreds of years ago. During all of history there were both jewish and arabs living in Israel. Calling the jewish people of Israel "colonists" is trying to change history and paint it as if jews came on ships to this country like conquistadors. After WW2, the UN decided that, maybe, after trying to exterminate the jewish people, it would make sense to give them some small pice of land to officially call their own. The arabs, instead of accepting the split launched a war in whclich they lost. And yes, many people were evicted from theor homes. Such is war. Then, they had multiple chances to accept peace offerings and build a country, instead they kept rejecting the offers and kept launching attacks at Israel. Culminating with the oct/7 attack which is where we find ourselves today. As i mentioned earlier, you and many around the world would like the Jews to just die. That won't happen. What you should be doing is making memes about Hamas and how they keep enriching their leaders pockets and building terror infrastructure instead of helping the Palestinian people.

So you're calling for decolonization of all countries in the world? Every person should immigrate back to their country of origin? And how long back is "country of origin" defined? Do you acknowledge that all Jewish people originate from Israel or is that something we need to debate as well?

The Palestinian people have had many many options to accept a two state solution and "be free". But they will never be free because their leaders only want the distruction of Israel and death of all jews. And, since the people and the rest of the world are intent on critisizing only Israel and making no moves towards freeing the Palestinian people from Hamas, they will NOT be free.

I think it's unfair to expect a people to just belly up and die because Jihadists are using their own people as human shields. There have been over 7 times where the Palestinian people have had a chance to establish an actual state. They refused each and every time. So I'm struggling to see a parallel between what Israel is doing (defending its people) vs what you are suggesting.

Umm. Generalize much? Sure there are some people fitting that description but the vast majority of holocaust survivora have led hugely successful lives. Heck, they built Israel.

Please go on. Where should the jews go? Which countries in the world would gladly accept 7 million jews? And by abolishing the Israel state I assume you are a big supporter of Sharia law. So no women rights, all LGBT people should be put to death, etc...

1. Hang on, don't stop. Which countries? And by new palastine do you mean the one controlled by Hamas who have kill all jews and christians in their charter? So basically just kill everyone who is currently living in Israel?
2. So all the christian and muslim arabs who are Israeli citizens too. Right? You wouldn't want to come off as a racist impliying only jews should be displaced would you?

So you support the displacement of the people of israel?

1. Where to?
2. Which people? Anyone who is an Israeli citizen?

Wait, if you agree that their "ruling class" is living in splendor. Where is your apartheid argument? Shouldn't you be critisizing the Palestinian ruling class for not taking care of the general state of their country?