40k: would the majority of the eldar eventually become as deranged as the dark eldar if the fall didn't happen?
Many eldars were already seeking extremes but the dark eldar do not seem to be the norm of that time. Given time would they have eventually have eventually become like drukhari apart from the few exodites?
Entire thing is incredibly suspicious. Their civilization lasted for at least 65 million years. 65 MILLION years, meaning it was incredibly static and they didn't fallen at any point in this time. And we know they didn't until 20-something millenium because there was apparently peace with humanity, full power Eldar empire could destroy humanity at any time, but they instead allowed humans to take nearly entire galaxy (with their empire being fairly small territorially, most of their population concentrated in what later became Eye of Terror). Now can you imagine what would happen if entire Eldar empire was like drukhari? They would slaughter or enslave humanity, which didn't happen. Conclusion is that they weren't decadent as a species.
Incidentally, their fall happened roughly at the same time Emperor started to seek to lead the humanity. But what prevented him? Humanity being too powerful, Dark Age human empires would't accepted his rule easy, and Eldar with their incredibly powerful psykers posed a mortal threat too.
My theory is that being crazy deranged nazi (and most powerful psyker in galaxy) he caused the fall of Eldar, possibly using small decadent faction (remember that the main source on decadency of Eldar is Vect words and he's not really famous for truthfulness and he also have every reason to portray every Eldar as being as fucked up as he is) thus starting the turmoil that would eventually turn into Age of Strife and prepare the galaxy for his conquest.
Supposedly the first "pleasure cults" started springing up during the late Dark Age of Technology. my head-canon/theory is that humanity's explosive use of early warp drive weakened the Veil in ways the webway never did, and the sheer number of humans starting slow psychic awakening caused ripple effects in the Inmaterium which cascaded through the hyper-sensitive Eldar (and through the warp's amplifying effects was basically reflected back at humanity as well)
it was something that had never happened during that entire 65 million year period. the sheer scale of DoAT warp drive useage and the population of humanity, trillions of which were outside the post-scarcity utopian core worlds doing genocide, colonialism, and imperialism on untold planets and fighting small private wars, likely feeding the warp as well.
the highly disciplined Eldar suddenly found gnawing, whispering voices at the edge of their perception. new feelings. tempting, encouraging. alien voices.
Yeah that would be good explanation too. Both points out to humanity though and that development in Eldar society was something lightning fast for them, like if entire humanity suddenly turned to Jasenovac level of fuckery in 5 minutes.
Also fucking Old Ones, they set up Eldar for failure and suffering.
There is interesting fragment in Da Big Dakka by Mike Brooks that all usage of the warp is forbidden in Comorragh, but when the part of TekWaaagh invade one of the Comorragh outskirts they started to use teleportation tech (not even that much of it) it very quickly ends with a demon invasion.
I question it. Its likely they saw humans as beneath them but drukhari level deranged? I imagine the whole 40k galaxy would be as bad as the warp. Their weapons are made to inflict as much pain possible. One blade that causes the flesh to eat itself at the smallest scratch. Honestly you're morally obligated to wipe every last one of them frpm existence
Its like another I have about the other three chaos gods being formed when they did.... Why wasn't it during the war in heaven when it was the most devastating war on record? Maybe they did form and were not self aware or sentient. And time works weird in the warp. The old ones were insanely powerful psykers and they created the eldar who are psykers
Its like another I have about the other three chaos gods being formed when they did.... Why wasn't it during the war in heaven
That's exactly when they formed, Khorne likely being the first. Remember, the galaxy is a biiiiiiig place. There's anywhere between 100 and 400 billion stars. Even if Chaos spread across a thousand solar systems each year, it still wouldn't have spread through the whole galaxy in 60 million years. Entire species evolved, became sentient, built civilizations, and went extinct before they encountered Chaos. The Warp itself is even more vast and infinite. So before Chaos could expand outwards into the materium, it had to evolve and develop within the immaterium.
Another reason is because Chaos is us, the audience, and the Warp is the real world outside of 40k. Humans were more preoccupied with what's actually happening and not writing fanfic for their toys. Hence, the previous 65 million years where nothing ever happens.
First rule of Aeldari lore is to never take Aeldari lore seriously. It's the same old elf rule that dictates there is always enough elves for the plot and not one more.
I thought the Dark Eldar were a toned down vestige of mainstream Eldar society? Like they can't just respawn after a quick dip in the warp any more so they had to dial back their excesses a bit and focus more on predatory sadism for safety.
Well thats horrifying if so. I thought they became more deranged due to trying to stave off slaanesh. Imagine the dark eldar being the dominant power in the galaxy just taking random beings as their playthings
How did you think they made Slaanesh in the first place?
Dark Eldar are what the majority of Eldar were before the Fall. They're the remnants of Eldar civilization who avoided Slaanesh because they were in the Webway when the fourth Chaos God was born. Harlequins were in a similar situation, where the Laughing God whisked them into the Webway to hide.
Craftworld and Exodite Eldar are outliers. They were weird doomsday fanatics who decided to cut themselves off from the rest of Eldar society. Craftworld Eldar fled aboard craftworlds, of course, while Exodites settled on planets around the outskirts of the galaxy. Then when the Fall happened, they became the majority of the Eldar race existing in realspace because everyone else was consumed by Slaanesh.
Since the Fall, Eldar have entered into a dark age. They can't use their psychic abilities to their full potential because it makes them easily possessed by demons. They can't reincarnate like they used to because that involves their souls surviving in the Warp. The various groups have different ideas on how to solve these problems. Dark Eldar feed Slaanesh souls in their place to reincarnate and extend their immortality, while banning the use of psychic powers entirely. Craftworlders, Exodites, and most corsairs rely on spiritstones to bind their souls to a physical object so they don't have to enter the warp, while using the smallest of psychic powers on-par with the ones used by humans.
But anywho, their whole race had become engulfed in hedonistic nihilism due to their immortality and ability to reincarnate, coupled with infinite resources. Post-Fall, they've had to condition themselves in different ways to avoid these behaviors. Or in the case of Drukhari, double-down and use others to maintain their sadism.
Yeah I read theory.
HEY JUST BECAUSE I'VE READ MORE 40K RULEBOOKS THAN COMMIE MANIFESTOS DOESN'T MAKE ME A NERD, OKAY?
(painting and playing with toys as a grown-ass person does)
Very good explanation breh. I got a question... Were they actively hunting/farming other species for torture pre fall or this increased massively post fall due to slaanesh
Both. Pre-Fall they definitely did more to other Eldar because 1) there were more Eldar; 2) some Eldar were willing volunteers wanting to experience more and more extremes. Of course, they also took pleasure terrorizing other species, like children torturing animals.
Commorragh still has a large slave population of Eldar, in addition to the larger population of captured non-Eldar. Asdrubeal Vect has claimed he was once a slave who managed to take over the city after the Fall, becoming de-facto ruler of the Drukhari. There are very few who would be able to verify this claim, however, since the number of pre-Fall survivors alive in M41 is tiny.