2d ago

idk

66 comments

Somebody should really report these MAGA people for their anti-Christian biases
- Fundamentalist protestants hate Catholics almost as much as they hate Jews and Muslims.
  
  The evangelicals I know deny that catholics are even christian. I understand it's some stupid wordplay - they call themselves Catholic instead of Christian therefore they aren't Christian. We don't self identify as a denomination, simply as Christian because obviously we are the correct, default choice.
  
  It’s not ridiculous for Protestants to say catholics aren’t Christian. Protestant movements came about because they believed the Catholic Church wasn’t teaching the word of God. It’s not a coincidence it came about at a similar time to the printing press.
  As people became more literate they started to learn the contradictions between the priests and the bible. The reaction to this resulted in movements that preached personal relationships with God and rejection of false profits (worshiping popes, saints etc).
  If your not aligned with either of these religions is seems ridiculous. The reality is you can’t think Protestantism is the correct path if you believe Catholics are Christians. This is the same for many religions, they mostly claim they are right and everyone else is wrong.
  
  The above doesn't track. Every sect of Christianity thinks its the "true" sect, but you aren't likely to see a Methodist claim an Baptist isn't Christian. They just claim they aren't following god correctly.
  Attempting to remove catholics or even mormons from being "Christian" at all is just a push to de-legitimize them as religions entirely. It's not reasonable, it's hateful by design, an intentional "othering."
  
  Mormons are non-trinitarian, so I'd say people trying to claim that they're not Christian have a much better case than protestants saying Catholics aren't Christian.
  
  They believe in the same god, son and the holy spirit, but believe they are separate-ish, yes.
  I think that's just a case of degrees of "how we see the same god," so i'd call that a pretty weak argument, honestly.
  
  I don’t think you got the central point. Protestants exist to protest Catholicism. A Protestant that recognises catholics as Christian’s wouldn’t be a Protestant.
  Different sects of Protestantism are able to recognise other sects as Christian’s because a central tentant of Protestant practice is the personal relationship with God. So different sects of Protestants find that easier to accept. Where as Catholics practice a relationship with God that is tied to the organisation and the Pope.
  Mormons are arguably a different religion altogether. Similar to how Jewish/Christian/Islam all share similar but different religious texts making them all different religions.
  The intended outcome is othering.
  You misunderstand reasonable. It does not mean good, more the natural conclusion given the context.
  
  One group that INVENTED their version of Religion, hates that other group who invented a slightly different version of the same Religion that uses the same reference book with all the same cast of characters. Its like one theater troupe wanting to murder another theater group because they disagree with their costume choices in the exact same play.
  And ALL of it is a fantasy, supported by stories made up by neolithic goatherders to pass the time.
  
  Mormons are absolutely Christian. They believe in christian god, christ as savior, etc. They simply have an extra, more modern prophet who "discovered" more scripture.
  This is exactly my overall point. Protestants/Catholics/Mormons all believe Christ is mankinds savior. Those are all Christians. As long as they have that central tenant, that's the only relevant aspect to being classed under that label.
  Jews/Muslims do not, and therefore are not Christians. That doesnt make sense with Catholics/Mormons, since Christ is the central element of both faiths. The push to label them as non Christian is the hateful aspect. It excludes on arbitrary lines in order to delegitimize what is often more "caring/kind/etc" teachings than a lot of the modern evangelical/Protestant faiths.
  
  That is only a half truth. There is an actual official list of things you must believe to be Christian called the Nicene Creed. “You must believe in God the Father, made man by his son Jesus of Nazareth, incarnate by the holy spirit, made of the same substance, for us and our salvation.” Bit cut down, but you get the point, the Trinity. Mormons do not believe in the trinity and are therefore not Christian. Protestant, Orthodox, ans Catholic all believe in the trinity and are therefore Christian.
  
  I don't think I'd agree you must believe in the Nicene Creed to be Christian. Did Christians not exist prior to 325? Or perhaps even 381, when its current amended form was created?
  I'd definitely say being non-Nicene puts a bit of an asterisk on claims and opens you up to discussion about whether or not you're truly Christian, but I wouldn't say it's a clear-cut thing.
  
  Hard disagree on all points. Of course Christians existed prior to 325, that is where the idea of the trinity comes from. It is why the Nicene creed exists in the first place. The only large groups that do not believe in the Trinity are Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Unitarians, and Oneness Pentecostals. All of which no other church considers Christian besides themselves. Of all the church teachings this might be the only clear cut definition of Christianity.
  
  Mormons add a large extra chunk. Other dominions have different interpretations and some added teachings but it's not entirely unreasonable
  
  Not entirely unreasonable except for the whole thing where it's clearly a bronze age myth that has somehow survived into modernity
  
  Well don't ya know, Jesus came 1800 years earlier on the other side of the planet to set up his fav country. All others he doesn't bless.
  
  I don't know which has a more absurd origin story, in terms of how ridiculous it is to believe it given the history of how it started (irrespective of the actual dogmas), Mormonism or Scientology.
  
  American ideologies. If they didn't make it to crazy religion status, they died trying as a crazy cult. And all the rest are about getting rich despite the odds and humanity.
  
  Scientology has grotesque space aliens flying across the universe in jumbo jet shaped space craft and dumping millions of souls into volcanoes that later attach to your soul and hinder your life.
  Mormons have dumb stories about land bridges and magic dudes doing extra magic to hide secret texts for bigamists to find.
  I think Scientology has got this one.
  
  Uh uh, I specifically said I was only talking about how each religion got started. So in Scientology we're talking about a science fiction author who had previously said the way to get rich is to start a religion. The nature of that religion is irrelevant.
  For Mormonism, we've got an American treasure hunter who happened to find American-Jesus fanfiction written on some plates, translated them by looking into a hot with a rock, and then when asked to repeat it to verify it said "whoops, I lost the plates, but here's some other ones that tell the same story but slightly differently". And nobody outside his inner circle was ever allowed to actually see the plates to verify their existence.
  So in one we've got a wild story full of very lucky coincidences and circumstantially-suspicious claims. And in the other we've got a much simpler story, but it's pretty explicitly telling us it's a scam.

66 comments