Number of Americans who never want kids doubled in 20 years

We're barely surviving ourselves. We can't afford kids if we do want them.

I never wanted kids, they just don't interest me and the cost is exorbitant. Spoke to a refugee lady at vwork and she had kids whilst on the run from government gumen. Oh you just have them and worry about it later.. it's a totally different attitude. In the west you need 3 jobs and a paid off home plus a nutritionist to consider it, in other places it just happens and noone questions your eating habits under fire. I think i agree with the non westerners on this, have them or don't, just stop making it a rigmarole.
- The privileged are blessed/cursed with the breathing space for foresight, anticipating and trying to avoid all the pitfalls and problems that they can foresee... which are endless. People in survival mode are living day-to-day, hand-to-mouth, and have no time to consider their long game.

I wonder how many are white people with a decent income who have two dogs, want to travel and to play Elden ring.
- Only one dog and only little interest in travel, but correct otherwise. More of a spa person.
  
  I don't care.
- Me, but I have no dogs and don't play video games.
- Me. But I have 3 dogs.

its almost always the one thing that is a problem in most low-birth rate countries, that the govt ignores. HCOL, raising a child is very expensive+ political instability, causing deaths and misery.
- I'd really like to see the evidence for this statement, since it really seems like this trend is just an extension of the phenomenon we see in poorer countries: when you give women education, opportunities, and birth control, fewer of them will have children. It stands to reason that the more education, the more opportunities available, and the more freely accessible birth control is, the fewer women will have children.
  
  In poor countries, children are a long-term economic asset. They will eventually be able to work and contribute to the family's income and can take care of their parents when they're older.
  In developed countries, children are an economic liability.
  
  There is also that sure but biologically people want to have kids, the extreme cost of living experienced by many prevents them from having kids

People without financial security: "kids are too expensive and I would be exhausted trying to provide for them"
People with financial security: "I'm having a good time, adding a kid to this mix would really require a step back in my lifestyle."
- The key to making this a lesser issue when it comes to keeping birth rates high is, in my opinion, a solid foundation of community trust and communal childcare.
  The phrase "it takes a village" didn't just spawn out of nowhere, after all. When communities can share the responsibilities of raising children, not only does it lead to a better quality of life for the kids because they tend to get more social interaction time in and better access to their community's resources, but it also takes the burden off a lot of parents since it stops being a 24/7 job, and more of a shared, common duty to their community that is only sometimes needed, and is flexible in the case of them needing a break.
  Of course, to get something like this, you need to fix the fact that we live in a very low trust society, and that is extremely difficult to do.
- The second ones are idiots. There’s nothing that can compare to family. No amount of kayaks or hiking or drugs will ever fill that void
  
  See I would compare it to the permanent dread of bringing children into a world that you knew would not be a good life for them given the trajectory we are locked into now.
- And yet the people most concerned about birth rates fight the hardest against anything that would make people have more kids
- There's also the moral question of "do I want to add a living person to the world I wish I didn't exist in?"
  
  If you are person number 2 and thus having good time you probably would want to share the good time
  
  Even if money weren't an issue for me, I'd be worried my pessimistic outlook on life would crush my potential child's spirit.
  
  That's why I think if I'm gonna have a kid some day it will be via adoption.

I want kids, but the government is doing their damndest to make it as difficult as possible for us by crashing the economy, cutting all federal programs, staffing agencies with NPCs, etc. Give generous paternity leave stipulations, tax credits, legalize surrogacy, and give credits for AI (artificial insemination) and surrogacy. Not to mention universal healthcare and child care credits.
Make it easy for us to have kids, and we will, lol. Quit cockblocking us.
- Quit cockblocking us
  It's more like semen blocking

I don’t want kids because I’m selfish with my time and don’t want to dedicate it to taking care of them. I don’t like kids because they are loud, smelly, and annoying.
That’s all there is to it. There’s nothing deep here. I like free time and quiet and don’t want to sacrifice that for 20+ years.
- I don’t like kids because they are loud, smelly, and annoying.
  My sentiments. Also, being on the spectrum doesn't help. I do not have the capacity. I would be a terrible parent.

All these people with great rational reasons... Meanwhile, my wife and I just don't like children.
- Not liking them is reason enough. That would be a miserable childhood to be raised by people that don't want them.
- This is my boat... THEN I got a lot of rational reasons I didn't want.
- Honestly I don't either, but I am also not above using it as a philosophical cudgel against fascism. If I'm going to get shit for not wanting kids the least I can do is redirect the conversation to politics.
- I've never really liked "children" in the sense of the age group, but I know a bunch of people who have really great, meaningful relationships between adult children and their parents, so I wanted adult children in my late middle ages and retirement ages.
  Now, with my own children, I primarily see them as future adults who I get to watch develop into cool people.
  
  Same. I also expected to like all children more after having mine, but I don't. Even though I adore my kid, I still dislike children.
- I'm sure the evolved brain chemical soup would make me like my own selfishly, but generally yeah I just don't like kids. I don't like interacting with them at all. I didn't even when I was one, and I'm certainly not a "cool uncle."
  I had to warn my sister before she had her first not to get mad at me for not conforming to some fantasy relationship that might only exist in her head. She's like that, so it was to get ahead of any hurt feelings. I couldn't realistically make that happen even if I wanted to.
- I love my kid, but the time suck is real.
  I get about an hour and a half a day of free time, which I should probably be using to clean.
  If we had shorter work days it would be far better, though we bid up housing prices using loose monetary policy so that's not happening. Most people aged to procreate are funding boomers poor retirement planning.
  
  eg, thier medicaire/caid. you would have to be very poor to use medicaid. the most chronic conditions people have on medicare, is DIABETES TYPE 2, AND comorbidities.
  while i was at a uni library, i overheard these 2 barely 20 something woman(assumed they were 18-19 by the way they were talking), talking about having kids at 25-30, where you going to have kids if you dont have a career yet, and you are barely an adult right now.
  when i was HS, a mother waited too long to change his sons way (future direction) she would often come in during his classes and moniter his classwork for any lowering grade, and would chatised the class "your parents would care this much if they care about his son", i was thinking, "this bitch, you waited 4years too long to change him, he was dead set on not going to college, when he told us". shouldve done it before he was in HS, and not waited til he was about to graduate with a low or participation passing gpa(like many people in the hs at the time).(i havnt kept track of him, only saw him once when i was IN CC)
- Seriously. I can handle being with family for a while, but would absolutely lose all will to live if I had to be near children every single day. Even more if I was actually supposed to be responsible for them. There are a lot of good reasons to not get children, the best one I have is that I just don't want to be near them.
  
  I'm on holiday right now with my extended family. The youngest is 18. It's been great but today is the sixth and final day and I'm ready to go home so I can chill out on my own. The thought of going home and spending more time with this group of adults I'm related to fills me with dread. I can't imagine what it would be like if one of them was a young child, let alone one that I had to be responsible for.

How about "Number of Americans who responsibly agree not to raise kids into poverty doubled in 20 years"
40 years of raising the burden on the middle class without applicable wages will do that to a society.
Raising what burden you say? Wages to cost of living.
- This. If you don't have kids there are basically no support systems to start a family. Wages aren't high enough and it looks like a daunting task. But if you have kids, suddenly you can qualify for food stamps and assistance(which is good). The system is basically set up to help prevent you from failing once you've already done it, but not to set you up to do it successfully beforehand. To have kids, you basically have to say "fuck it, we'll just figure it out". A lot of people aren't willing to take that risk.
  
  suddenly you can qualify for food stamps and assistance(
  I wouldn't bet on that being a sure thing in a couple of months/years :)

Originally I never wanted kids because it sounded like it'd get in the way of all the other stuff I want to do in life.
Now I don't because I see it as unethical.

If I hate the capitalism rat race I'm stuck in with all the uncertainties and the never ending grind and the deteriorating planet, why would I be motivated to bring kids into this world, knowing full well that I don't have the fuck you money needed such that they wouldn't have to go through the same rat race grind as me. Seems cruel.

Governments do slim to nothing to invest in supporting their populace education, daycare, cost of living.
Why would I bring life into this country to experience the harsh, expensive, cold existence?
They cant even properly care for the sick or elderly. Only thing they care about is making money off of us.
- Instead of socialized child care, Republicans will be like "LETS BAN CONDOMS"
- most of them are just nagging, or trying to encourage more sex. no support for mothers and childcare, housing, wage crisis, political issues, climate issues. the wealthy dont want any of this to happen so thats why they have used propaganda and culture wars/
- That’s why Donald loves the uneducated.
  
  Any politician in a democracy would love the uneducated. My country is the prime example, literally all the parties just want to impress the dumb and uneducated

I love my daughter. She’s 4yo. She’s so amazing. But if I knew what I knew now in the US… I would not put her in it.

Never want kids = realizing I'll never be able to afford them
- Well yeah but there's more too. The climate is a factor in people's choices as well.
  
  It's it that they don't want kids as in no matter what they are never having kids... or they only don't want them because of economy...etc. I took it as they do not want kids under any circumstances.
- Also, they're sticky, and no one wants to deal with that.
- ~~realizing I'll never be able to afford them~~
  realizing I'll never be able to afford them without sacrificing the slightest inch of my current lifestyle
  FTFY
  I don't fault you. You do you. Just stop blaming the economy.
  People have been willingly having children through times tougher than anything you have or ever will experience.
  You just don't want kids. And that's fine.
  Just stop scapegoating the economy.
  
  It costs 19,000 on average without insurance just to birth a child. I currently have to have 3 roommates just to make rent. How about you go fuck yourself?

The economy is going great.

"I wanna be a fireman when I grow up!"
rubs kids hair
(He doesn't have a future)
^ that's why. I'm not raising someone on the idea that their life will be complete shit because there's zero proof to the contrary.
- Trust me. It's crushing raising a child right now In America. I have to navigate these weird questions without scaring the shit out of him. Hes almost 10, and is too sweet for the world we exist in now. He shouldn't have to bear the weight of our future, but people who like trump don't deserve a future, and God forgive those who opposed my child. Fuck my life but I'll go nuclear for my child.

I feel so guilty towards my 10 year old. I never planned to have kids. I never wanted to have kids. But it happened anyways and I love him more than anything, and its so depressing knowing for a fact that he doesn't have nearly the same outlook on his future. I cut off my MAGAt mother and now me and my kid are solid, but I know the future has shit foundations and a mild win only lasts so long, but it feels so good to cut toxicity out of your life. Shame that it's mostly meaningless these days.

If you think that is amazing, you should see the spike within the last three months!

It seems like child abuse to bring someone into this shithole of a world.
- That's why I don't want to do it. Anyone born now or later are going to experience a slow painful death due to lack or resources or a quick painful death in a resource war. And if they have any smarts they would hate my guts once they figure out the fate I had knowingly consigned them to by forcing their concious into a meatsuit.
  
  yup either getting propagandized beign sent as fodder for a war, or be miserable from the lack of career, education, job,,,etc.
  
  If being birthed required consent from the eventual person, no births would go to term.
- We also know more about genetically linked diseases than ever.
  I watched my grandmother on my mother's side die of ovarian cancer, which also killed my great grandmother, and afflicted one if my cousins. I would be practically condemning a daughter to the same fate because it's highly genetically linked.
  Similarly I watched Parkinson's, another highly genetically linked disease, take my grandfather on my mother's side.
  My father's side of the family has a genetic history of heart disease and high blood pressure and my father lost his own father to heart failure when his father was in his forties.
  Knowing your own families medical and genetic history also puts a damper on the whole enterprise.
  
  ^ this. There is so much chronic pain in my family at all ages. Not to mention rampant diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure, and severe mental illness. Most of the men on my moms side didn't live much past 60 that we're aware of. And that's just the stuff i know of!
  I have no doubt there's plenty more that people took to the grave without disclosing, or never knew about for themselves because they never saw a doctor in their lives.
  
  the question you could ask yourself might be "would you like to be born again, as your child, if you could?" that would give you a clear indication of whether it's worth it.
- That's why adoption is the best option. It's not your fault they exist, but they need a loving home.
  
  adoption is actually surprisingly expensive and difficult, and they vet the shit out of potential parents, heavily discourages single parents if there ever has been one. thats why some of them take advantage of going overseas to adopt. fostering might be more better.
  
  Adopting a 7 year old or older is the best option. There are 36 couples waiting to adopt for every infant that is up for adoption in the US. The older kids get largely ignored and will likely age out of foster care without ever finding a forever family.

no shit. Everying is too expensive. Between housing and education, you have lifelong debt. Who the fuck wants that for their children?
- Not to mention the knowledge of bringing kids into a world where we know the future is only going to get worse.

It's not that I don't want kids, it's more that they have created a world so fucked that I can barely even exist in it myself.
- Exactly. You have to have a very comfortable life if the idea of having a kid doesn't scare the shit out of you... that or you're the type of person that doesn't give a shit about your kids.

Pretty sure this is global.
And even if you do want kids, there are requirements that have to be met.
Stable income, high enough income, a home thats big enough... People can't have kids if half their income instantly disappears into the wallet of their landlord every month and get reamed with the other half at places like grocery stores.
- in the usa Insurance for health.

When I was younger I always figured I would be ready for kids some day. At the current rate of progress, that some day will be when I'm about 170, which is still a few decades before I'll be able to retire.
- I'll have kids when Republicans apologize for electing Donald Trump. So I'm going to need two apologies. In the official party platform.
  "We sincerely regret the extremely dark places our ideology led this country. Everyone who opposed us since Nixon was right about everything, and here are the steps we are taking to prevent this in the future."
- You would be categorized in the study as "childless" - wanting children but being unable to have them - and thus would not be part of the headline statistic.
  
  The way the article describes it, they seem to mean infertile rather than simply not prepared. Since I am (as far as I know) entirely capable of having kids, it would mean I am in either the not yet parents or childfree category, depending on whether I still plan to have kids.

Today's Headline: US government investigating ways to send US citizens without trial to El Salvadoran concentration camp.
Tomorrows Headline: Birth rates plummet in unprecedented and unexpected collapse.
- Except for the part where the fertility rate in El Salvador is higher than it is in the USA. If we're becoming more like them, our fertility rate should be increasing.
  
  Skateparkge
  
  I don't think that was the point they were making...

Wonder if they're just being honest vs feeling more strongly
- Yeah, most of the comments are about not wanting to bring kids into this world because of the economy, climate crisis etc. but there has to also be an element of acceptance for people just being childfree now.

We could probably do with some slow to the exponential population growth. The problem (as foretold by Mike Judge) is that doubling population of non-kid havers are the ones that are thoughtfully considering their futures. Meaning the pool of intelligent, responsible people that are having kids is getting smaller.
- The global fertility rate (the number of child born per woman) has been declining since 1963 or so, and is almost at replacement level, which is usually considered 2.1 or so.
  Population is still going up since global life expectancy is still rising, but the expectation is that population will peak in 50 years or so.

crazy, house prices also doubled/quadrupled during that time. i wonder if theres a connection?
- something places asia seems to ignore, but they insist of encouraging sex but nothing to accomadate the mother and child once they are born. they just want them to be born, thats about it.
  housing is the biggest reason, certain job prospects in many degreed fields are pretty dismal as it is, cost of raising a child is also huge too and daycare.

I think voting in a strongman leader who restores traditional family values like poverty, political violence and death camps will totally reverse this trend.
- Yup. Probably some of you guys remember a TV series with the plot of women being used as birth machines due to some global crises. At that time it was just a plot of a TV series. Today, I'm not sure about that anymore.
  
  there was a movie that one of the plots was using "braind dead" woman kept alive by machines and used as birthing incubators. Another show BSG, the cylons used woman in the hoped to reproduce with them, ironically hooked up to machines as well tob e birthing mares.
- Too real.

I want kids. I can’t afford to have kids.

Responsible people not having kids while careless people do. How many generations before society implodes for that reason alone?
- You just described India's current population growth. The responsible rich and middle class couples are living a good life without kids while the illegal immigrants and the people who can't afford are having 4-5 kids
  And the politicians (both from the left and right wing) love the dumb and uneducated.
- giving birth to "not let them have it" sounds a lot like "owning the libs"
  self-harming behaviour because everything is made into a competition.
  
  My comment was meant more as a question about the development than an appeal. Even if responsibility is an inheritable trait, society could be better off e.g. if people worry less.

It's hard enough to not paint the ceiling red. It would be cruel to bring kids into the hell.
- I'm right there with you, not to mention it takes 2 to have kids and I've been single for a decade now. I'm only sticking around until my older family members are gone so I don't hurt too many people, but after that I'm out.
  I have no interest in seeing just how god awful the future will be while knowing I'll never retire and will be stuck forever renting someones basement/garage.
  
  Yup. Staying alive for the parents. After that, fuck it.
  
  So uh... Related question: Do corporations have insurance in the event of someone turning themself into a fine red mist that would be expensive to clean up on their property? 🤔
  
  how god awful the future will be while knowing I’ll never retire and will be stuck forever renting someones basement/garage
  Could you imagine wasting the rest of your life to make the world a better place? Since you are alreay alive, what do you need to create a future worth living with others who think alike?
- That's really sad. Not the kid part but the other. I hope you're able to get some help because people almost certainly care about you.
  
  I have not enjoyed life since part way through elementary school and I have wanted to end it since middle school. I am now in my early 30s. My parents care and are the main reason I keep going, but I have come extremely close numerous times. Honestly, it makes sense with how I have been treated by society, people, and life. At this point I am mostly numb and dead inside so that helps.

I used to deal with heavy depression, even into my 30s. I also have a number of health issues. That was enough to decide to get snipped. Bringing a kid into this world as things get worse than they have been in a long time in a number of places... absolutely not.

- You’re retired at 47? There’s isn’t a single thought you could come up with that anyone wants to listen to after you drop that gem.
  
  Just because you are miserable and jealous, doesn’t mean everyone else is also.
  
  What's your problem? If you had a financial windfall that meant you could retire, are you saying you wouldn't?

They made life an unbearable nightmare. I refuse to bring another life into this world against it's will, born into an unnecessary struggle against an upper class that only sees us as chattel to be used as exploitable labor

Yooooo what’s up

Do I hold resentment against my parents for subjecting me into this bullshit of a world? Not really... They couldn't have known it was going to get this bad three decades ago.
Do I intend on subjecting another human to this bullshit of a world? Hell no! I decided long ago that if I ever wanted kids than I was going to adopt. There's people out there who've got it worse than I do and I would rather help improve the life of somebody who's already here than bring in a whole new consciousness all for the sake of continuing my genetic legacy.
- I still blame them a bit. They had no business having kids.
  
  Nah man. At those times, the middle class could easily afford a home and the lives of 4 people. While nowadays getting a job is considered a big thing

Honestly my spouse and I were on the fence until Trump got elected… the first time; the second time just helped ensure us we made the right choice.
Edit: Oh, right, also the climate crisis. That hasn’t gotten better either.

As someone with kids, I don't blame modern society, honestly. I tell my own kids to think long and hard before they have kids themselves. Life isn't easy and I never really thought I would have kids, but I did it.
I would never trade them in for freedom or childless life. They did change me and, in a ton of ways, make me a better person.
But I would never judge anyone for not having kids.
- Thanks for being a parent in a hard time. A lot of us didn’t have kids so that the kids that do exist have more resources and leverage for jobs. Let your kids know that A LOT of adults care about them, not just the ones they see with families.

I’ve never wanted kids.
Life changed a lot right as we both were turning 40. Family members died, I finally had a good job, we moved out of one of the most expensive cities in the US.
Now we have a 7 year old and life is very different, some better some worse, but mostly different.
Things change.
- stable and high income, plus a home.
  
  Funny thing is we lost both those right before the pandemic and are now living with and caring for the remaining parent who’s losing his mind.
  We might have ended up in the same place without our child, but it’s been more fun with them than either of us imagined.

I have kids. I love them. They are my hope for the future, and I have never once regretted the decision to have them.
I completely understand why people don't want kids. I wouldn't try to talk anyone into it.
- Preach on. Same boat, but just one kid.
  
  Thank you both for being parents. Once the kids are here, they deserve protection and nurturing, not regret.
- More liberals should have kids. If the only people who are having kids are conservatives, we shouldn't be surprised when the next generation turns out more conservative than we expect.
  I wouldn't try to actively talk people into having kids, though, because that's weird and creepy, and none of my damn business.
  
  More liberals should have kids.
  We can't outbreed stupid: stupid breeds like rabbits. If that's what our planet is depending on, it's a lost battle from square one. Having a kid just so it can be a footsoldier against a hoard of orcs is cruel as fuck.

Welcome to Costco. I love you.

Must be those damned avocados, they mess with our brains.

Two big reasons I decided not to have kids: even before Trump, I didn’t trust any large government to take the serious, permanent, expensive measures required to address our environmental issues… not before it’s too late, that is.
Secondly, the cost of living (in the US) is insane, and probably just going to get worse. I don’t think it’s fair to saddle children with the mistakes caused and perpetuated by previous generations.
- If you want to look at the Cost of Living in the US as a Blue vs. Red state :: Contrary to popular belief, blue states tend to be cheaper than red in the long term (5+ years).
  
  probably depends on where you live big cities vs a town ,, or something. i wonder if GOP red states purposely saddle the blue counties with more taxes, or make it more expensive for them?

Wonder why.

And recent events will undoubtedly send it higher.
Who in their right mind would want to add new victims to this fucking trainwreck of a timeline?

Well don't worry women are not going to have much Choice soon. You can see the plan. You can see the steps they are taking.

well yeah, kids suck. wife and i agreed to not have kids because we hate them. <.<

Moar!

People not being able to afford them most likely.

Nice work, Blackrock.
- Nimbyism, in the west. when a nearby county wanted to convert a defunct hotel into a housing for low-income people, the rich nimby, yes and WHITE came out of the woodworks to block the building.
  I also call it the re-gentrification of the west coast, basically the white flight happen eons again, but they are returning in large numbers in our area nd started immediately opposing thier demands and we encountered our fair share of these karens demand you cant do this and that near thier street or thier house are were often loud and obnoxious/condescending when talking to a POC. and cafes are a sign gentrification.they got rid of one of our highways just so they can have biking and walking, it was a cruical highway to quickly travel outside a city, its been redirected elsewhere. we have Bicycle douche organization that did a lot legislative damage to the streets.

Looking forward to making up the difference for everyone that decided against kids.
- Make one extra from my side
- The people who say this are NEVER the ones society actually wants doing this
  
  Is this the same society made up of people self-selecting themselves out of the next generation? If so who cares?
- Make a couple extra for me. Gonna enjoy life and then forever leave this wretched place
  
  No problem 👍