Talking to a (generally) progressive friend about their islamophobe brainworms
Talking to a (generally) progressive friend about their islamophobe brainworms
I have a good friend who is generally good politically, not one of us but not bad. A socdem who is aware enough to know NATO is bad and Palestine deserves justice etc.
They’re very strong on feminism, advanced. More than me by far and I value their pov on feminism. A lot.
But they have Islamophobe brainworms. Mostly surrounding sexual violence in Europe by Muslims. They have a suite of rage bait statistics or anecdotes of sexual violence by Muslim men in Europe.
“See this isolated and context-free statistic which shows really the problem is Islam and the cultural values of these immigrants.”
The discussion for them becomes rooted in feminism.
“Why should women pay the price for all the sexual violence Muslim men bring with them? Honor killings are 100% Muslim!”
“X% of rapes are by muslims when they are only Y% of the population.”
“Why are all the immigrants men? We should ban the male refugees from these places, but as a good pro-refugee progressive we should allow the women and children in because they aren’t a problem.”
It’s tempting to try and fight this on data but I think that would kind of be conceding the deeper clash of civilizations argument in some way?
It’s also tempting to fight this on the grounds of material circumstances and point out that gender equality largely follows economic development but then that’s really just entirely conceding to the world view that Islamic immigration is an affliction upon European women for several generations until they assimilate.
I think a core problem here is that I am completely disconnected and unaware of what feminism looks like in the Muslim worlds and so I can’t speak to or challenge the underlying Islamophobia.
Of course there are issues with patriarchy in the Islamic world and when my friend points to the veil in Iran being enforced by the religious police and it’s impossible for me to deny that and I completely agree with them (while disagreeing with them insofar as I totally accept many Muslim women choose to wear it but then it becomes a complex go-nowhere discussion about peer pressure and bikinis) but then there’s this bridge from that true fact to the assertion that Islamic men are a threat to European women which is just like woah man wtf.
How do I approach this? Where’s my Muslim-world feminist perspective at? What are some considered debunks or analyses of the use of isolated statistics on sexual violence?
Like the best internet gotcha would be a statistical analysis that simply debunks the sexual violence statistics and that would be helpful but I believe there’s a deeper Islamophobia and sense of western cultural supremacy, clash of civilizations, thesis that they don’t explicitly acknowledge and I sense that feminism is being abused to ennoble that.
And on the flip side, I’m a male. I’m very unlikely to be a victim of sexual violence at this point in my life. I’m not going to be a victim of an honor killing. Do I have privilege I need to check here?
Overall I think the best would be for me to discover and learn feminist theory and female perspectives from Muslim / Arabic / Palestinian / Iranian / Afghan / Pakistani authors, both in the “Muslim world” and from those living in the west.
Maybe it would also be useful to look at how panic about black men raping women was used and is used to justify racial oppression as a consciousness raising exercise?
Considered feminist critiques of Islam?
Considered feminist critiques of Islamophobia in Europe?
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"Honor Killing" is such a ridiculous bugbear i'd actually forgotten islamophobes liked to use that. it has literally no relationship to islam, it's a special colonial descriptive applied to colonized people in Europe. when a white Belgian murders their wife & someone she's cheating with, that's not an "honor killing" but
and magically it becomes soI know that I sound cringe right now saying "as a muslim ☝️🤓" but honor killings still exist, even in western puppet states like Jordan.
I remember when I was little hearing my Mom cry in the living room and I asked her what happened. A Jordanian woman went on a walk with her fiance and his friend spread rumors about them going alone somewhere and her family ended up killing her. It was big news at the time. It's not normalized, neither are child marriages, but they still occur which is an issue sadly.
of course they exist, but the characterization of them as unique to muslims or the global south is completely manufactured for racist scaremongering. murders about miscegenation and adultery, murders over lgbt identification by family members---these occur in the
-sphere but don't get an orientalist legal proscriptionTrue!!! Thank you for being so nice :)
Yeah that’s one thing I notice with a lot of the statistics.
Like “religiously motivated violence against women” or “honor killings”… this is literally just when a man who is Muslim commits an act of gender violence since of course they’re going to use their ideology to justify their actions just like how if a men’s rights activist commits an act of gender violence they’re going to justify themselves using MRA bullshit or an incel will justify themselves with red pill nonsense.
It’s just drawing a circle around “when Muslim men do it”, defining a post hoc category of violence designed to capture violence when the perpetrator uses Islam to justify themselves, and surprise surprise the majority of them are Muslim.